XBMC Linux port questions and answers... - Printable Version
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- pike - 2007-05-31 23:10
On a happier note; Say Welcome to new member 'd4rk' who will help us with OpenGL coding on linuxport
- nate12o6 - 2007-05-31 23:18
- raid517 - 2007-06-01 00:45
ultrabrutal Wrote:raid, you keep talking about tying? no one is tying anything! we are talking about a common platform for support/development. there is nothing tied that will make it not work on any pc except incompatibilities in hardware and drivers on those pc's. appletv and macmini are just pc's. any incompatibility problems will of course also be fixed by users and/or team members one way or the other - so fear not!
The point I made wasn't so much about 'tying' as 'limiting'. It would be a shame to limit XBMC to a proprietary platform in this way. Firstly because you risk limiting your user base and second because not everyone will enjoy the idea of needing to go out and buy a property platform which they may or may not be able to afford simply to obtain a reasonable level of support.
I am however all for the developers sticking to a bunch of pretty standard off the shelf PC parts if this is what they wish to do (although I hope that as time passes, like Apple they will allow for some level of upgradeability and they will allow for these specifications to be improved upon as new developments in PC technology emerge. Even Apple after all do not build on entirely static platforms - despite having a very definite and defined set of supported hardware components).
I also think that if you build to a certain set of PC specific reference designs, the issue of whether XBMC will work on more generic platforms becomes much more trivial. If you can build XBMC and make it run on a few modern reference PC platforms the chances are that it will probably work pretty flawlessly on 95% of all other modern PC's too - so you instantly massively increase your potential user base. You also go a good deal of the way towards keeping costs for your users down.
Anyway the issue of support would be made a great deal simpler by building on top of an already existing distro - as many of these distributions already have a huge array of support for an equally vast array of hardware. The key would probably be to offer support for XBMC only and not for any distro/OS specific issues. That way users can get support for the distro in question from the normal support sources for that distro (of which there are many) and the XBMC developers can still continue to concentrate on XBMC development only. This is the way most other Linux developers work - and many of them appear to find this less of an issue than some of the XBMC developers appear to imagine.
- jonb2 - 2007-06-01 01:14
Quote:@jonb2, pike and I are the two Project Managers of The XBMC Project. Yes it is true that we do not always speak for all the developers, and we have/will never claim that we to do, however as active contributers to the project we do enjoy the ears of the projects developers which in most cases weighs more than someone that do not contribute at all. As with all open source hobby projects (which XBMC is) everyone working on the project do so for free, thus we can not bark orders at anyone. Eveyone have their own personal agenda for working on XBMC, some do it for fun, others for the challenge or experince, and some (if not most) do it because XBMC is a software that they themself use on a regular basis, (this is the reason why some features in XBMC no longer have an maintaner at all and are completly ignored, and why other existing and new features gain all the attention of some developers). Basicly if you want something done for sure in an open source software project then you have to do it yourself, so those who do nothing to contribute at all will most of the times just be ignored.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I don't know where you get that I'm trolling, and if it makes you feel big to band me for disagreeing with you not much I can do about it. As to barking orders, no haven't barked a single order to anyone, I'm guessing your talking about where i said; what I would like to see or what is possible. If you want to jump on someone thats trolling like a 10 year-old look at the person that was saying 'I don't have a clue' when they don't even understand the discussion.
As I've already said I think XBMC is the best around and many months ago said I would love to see it ported to linux. I think the devs did an amazing job with it upto this point on the xbox and I want to see grow. I don't want to see it's support locked down to proprietary apple niche product and when someone comes in with a question and they are told to go to www.somewhereelse.org because their question doesn't fit the covered support.
I understand the devs do it for free and am very grateful to them. I don't see how I've spread any f.u.d. when all I have been saying is that support should not be limited to niche hardware. There is no question the devs know what they are doing or that it will succeed or if it will run on various hardware configurations. It will. What I've been talking about is what this site will support, and I know do not have any control in that, but I do have an opinion.
I understand it is easier to support 1 thing then 2 or 10 etc... but it doesn't make sense to create something like XBMC which will appeal to millions and only support hundreds. By supporting a meer 4-5 interchangeable hardware configurations you go from supporting hundreds(mac niche hardware) to supporting hundreds of thousands (pc's hardware).
As to how I put my sentences together, I think you are reading more or less into them than is there. Unless I say something like 'The fact is' or something that explicitly implies fact, I'm stating my opinion. Just happens to be the way I talk/type, and not intended to offend. Though the one reply where I told the guy RTFM was intended to offend him, because he was clueless when he had no idea what he was talking about and randomly jump on me.
One thing I may be confused on: It is my understanding that the devs write the code and ops/admins/mods/managers run the site/forums. Is that correct ?
For the record I'm 30 something, and have owned and operated a computer service and repair company for the last 8 years and if you'd like to talk voice to voice. PM me and I'll give you ph. or setup a voip server.
I think I've wasted enough thread space going off topic to respond to you and maybe I've cleared up my point of view, if not then I guess this was my last post and I still look forward to XBMC on linux.
- szsori - 2007-06-01 03:37
Providing support for more than a handful of strict platforms will make the developer's lives hell. Supporting the Xbox is relatively easy right now because they don't have to worry about whether an issue is hardware related (with rare exceptions). Once you open the support to many hardware platforms the hardware related issues will far outnumber the XBMC related issues. The devs don't need that. Go on any other HTPC software's forums (Media Portal, Meedio, etc) and you'll find how odd things can get when you try providing support for all sorts of different hardware.
Keep in mind as well that we're only talking about OFFICIAL support. I'm sure if people have well known hardware that doesn't fit the official platform standards, there will be other users that will be able to provide some unofficial support. It's not like the developers are locking you out if you're not using the supported hardware. Also, by opening the platform to any hardware that can run linux, we'll be gaining a LOT of users that can provide unofficial linux support.
- ultrabrutal - 2007-06-01 09:41
once again... nothing is tied or limited! you can run xbmc on anything which supports it's requirements. the only thing here is that support will only be provided on the common selected platform which is not decided. you have no suggestions other that support any hardware and that is impossible and unrealistik. a function in xbmc can fail because of a driver issue or incompatibility between different hardware and where do you go? you go to xbmc support and say "this function does not work" when infact the problem is not xbmc but rather elsewhere. if you cannot see this problem so be it
- Jezz_X - 2007-06-01 10:41
wow everyone has so much to say on this topic
- Geeba - 2007-06-01 12:49
Jezz_X Wrote:wow everyone has so much to say on this topic
Theres alot of XBMC fans!!! imagine how many more there are that dont join forums.... its a big thing... I mentioned it last night in the pub to someone and they use it to! funnly enough.. and his mates and so on....
- jonb2 - 2007-06-01 13:38
ultrabrutal Wrote:once again... nothing is tied or limited! you can run xbmc on anything which supports it's requirements.
Quote:you have no suggestions other that support any hardware and that is impossible and unrealistik.Thats not what I said.
I've plainly said on 2 occasions in this thread that it will run on any number of systems...
Quote: There is no question the devs know what they are doing or that it will succeed or if it will run on various hardware configurations. It will.
Quote: once ported to linux this will run on ten thousand hardware configurations, no ifs and or buts.I did not suggest trying to support all hardware, but did suggest supporting the 2 most common pieces from the most popular vendors for each different hardware type 2 MB/CPU (AMD - Intel, 2 well actually 3 video ATI - Intel - Nvidia, Realtek - Sound Blaster) and I was not talking about every product each manufacture makes. What I am talking is picking 1 specific part from each manfacturer. Example off the top of my head: From nvidia you take the 7600, from ati you take the 1600, from Intel you take a 935 board and there current most common video chip. etc...
With only 7 specific parts you enable support for a much larger user base.
Hypothetical example: Next year joe blo comes along and has a brand new dell it's far more likely that if he follows the instructions already in place it will work because it based on similar hardware. But lets say it doesn't work, and he post a question asking for help. He shouldn't be told we don't support that go over to somewhereelse.com maybe they can help you, or buy one of these and we can walk you through it then. I'm not saying the world should stop and everyone should work on solving his problem, but if someone knows the answer or has a possible solution it should be discussed whether it is officially part of the covered support or not.
- grisen - 2007-06-01 16:36
Are there any plans on supporting TV cards as soon as the porting is done? AFAIK nor Apple TV or Mac Mini has TV cards, but I guess that lots of XBMC users would like to be able to add TV cards to their systems...