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Hardware for Linux and XBMC - Printable Version

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- Amphetamine - 2007-11-20

I'll give some figures here from my personal experience of HD playback on a couple of my machines:

My Ath64 3700+ HTPC machine in the bedroom gets almost perfect H.264/MKV 720P playback when using CoreAVC under XP Pro, but suffers quite a lot of droppage when running FFmpeg.

My Ath64 X2 6000+ Gaming rig hits around 60% CPU With CoreAVC When playing back H.264/MKV 1080P. FFmpeg is over 85%.

I'll probably be looking at a X2 5400+ for XBMC when the time comes.


For those who already have everything on NAS and are prety much just looking for a small/quiet/cool playback unit, these SATA DoM (Disk on Module) units may be of interest to you: http://www.milesie.co.uk/shop/asp/product1.asp?Product=672

Any word of what size disk footprint XBMCL will have?


On the subject of GFX cards, bottom of the range retail cards will genrally have very bad v-sync, causing image tearing all the time. The 7300GS cards are awful and I would avoid them like the plauge.

Would be interested to hear from anyone who's got a mobo that's got onboard gfx with HDMI out as to whether they suffer any sort of tearing on movie playback, as this is one of the options I'm considering for my XBMCL box.


- gosquad - 2007-11-20

I recently purchased a Shuttle SN68PTG5 barebones box with an AMD 6000+ CPU specifically for XBMC. I got the AMD version because the CPUs are cheaper and because it has a built in Nvidia 7050 card with HDMI out.

http://us.shuttle.com/barebone/Models/sn68ptg5.html

Sound through HDMI currently doesn't seem to be supported under ubuntu, so I've been using the spdif port.
I have had no problems with tearing on my collection of SD, 720 and 1080 encodes. Like your experience with the 6000+, 1080p under XBMC pushes the CPU to close to 100%. I only have one 1080p file, and it seems to play fine with 0 dropped frames. (running under mplayer uses a lot less cpu, though).
One small thing I did was replace the stock fan with a Zalman 90mm fan. It's a lot quieter and even running under full load, I've had no drastic problems with heat. Overall very satisfied.


- bripeace - 2007-11-22

I built a box for this just recently:

ABIT AN-M2HD AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 7050PV HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail
AMD Athlon X2 BE-2400 Brisbane 2.3GHz Socket AM2 Processor Model ADH2400DOBOX - Retail
Transcend AxeRAM 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model TX800QLJ-2GK - Retail
SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
Microsoft A9O-00007 WinXP Media Center Infrared Remote Control

At first the 2400 could play 720 h.264/mkv stuff okay... very little stuttering full cpu usage though completely unplayable with vsync (audio was fucked). I overclocked it about 10% and that got it down to flawless playing even with vsync @ about 100% cpu. I then overclocked it to 20% and it plays any 720p content @ 60% cpu with vsync and all. Also despite it being overclocked 20% it still is running on stock retail cooling very quietly 2 32 degrees celcius.

All around this is a great chip and a great system. I just need to add in a quiet sata dvdrom for watching dvd's and I'm set. Even set it up so it boots directly to XBMC so the wife can use it.


- rodalpho - 2007-11-25

My old Xbox is on its last legs; it intermittently refuses to start up, flashing orange and red lights. I give it a shake and mess around with the cables and it resusitates, but clearly I've got to move on. So it's time for XBMC-Linux. I was thinking about the following configurations from newegg, using an old EIDE hard drive I've got lying around for storage. I stream most stuff from my desktop over SMB anyway.

$099 CASE: antec NSK2480
$065 MOBO: MSI P6NGM-FD GeForce 7100 micro ATX
$130 CPU: C2D E4500 2.2Ghz
$048 RAM: 2GB DDR2-800
$030 DVD-R: sony 18x DVD+-R
$039 REMOTE: MS MCE remote + IR receiver
--------
$411+shipping total

or this config with AMD

$099 CASE: antec NSK2480
$075 MOBO: biostar tf7050-m2 AM2 geforce 7050PV micro ATX
$120 CPU: Athlon64 X2 5200+ AM2 2.7Ghz
$048 RAM: 2GB DDR2-800
$031 DVD-R: pioneer dvr-212dbk
$039 REMOTE: MS MCE remote + IR receiver
-----------
$412+shipping total

Which one would work better for XBMC-Linux? And does XBMC really need this much horsepower to play HD material? These aren't exactly low-end computers. Obviously the cheaper the better, but I want to get something that really works.

Speaking of which, is XBMC on linux really usable yet? I've built computers from scratch for years and I've worked as a linux sysadmin, so those aren't issues for me. I just need it to stream media and reliably play everything that XBMC on xbox does. Reliably being an important point.


- BLKMGK - 2007-11-25

The reason why such high performance setups are being specc'd is becasue the state of video acceleration on Linux vs Windows is so poor. http://xboxmediacenter.com/wiki/index.php?title=Hardware_Accelerated_Video_Decoding is a pretty good explanation as to what's going on. Drivers on Windows accelerate lots of different codecs, not so on Linux where you might only get MPEG2.Shocked

So when someone says they "shouldn't" need a powerful CPU for this because the same file on Windows only uses 30% CPU they don't realize that it's because their GPU is doing most of the work. You cannot use performance on Windows as any sort of basis for how it will work in Linux, at least not until the vendors get their act together and give the developers the acceleration that's needed. They have the knowledge it seems since they did it for Windows, I don't understand why it isn't also also done for Linux. <sigh>

In the meantime the heavy lifting is going to have to be done by the CPU, just as it was on the original XBOX hardware. That means FAST cores and probably more memory. Such is life.

If this were being done for Windows the heavy lifting part of video would be easier but the flexability would be FAR less. <shrug> Personally I'm THRILLED they are as far along as they are and while not a Linux wiz I'm going to play with this while waiting and hoping for an easy to install distro version. When they tell me what hardware to use I WILL buy it!


- gateway69 - 2007-11-26

BLKMGK Wrote:The reason why such high performance setups are being specc'd is becasue the state of video acceleration on Linux vs Windows is so poor. http://xboxmediacenter.com/wiki/index.php?title=Hardware_Accelerated_Video_Decoding is a pretty good explanation as to what's going on. Drivers on Windows accelerate lots of different codecs, not so on Linux where you might only get MPEG2.Shocked

So when someone says they "shouldn't" need a powerful CPU for this because the same file on Windows only uses 30% CPU they don't realize that it's because their GPU is doing most of the work. You cannot use performance on Windows as any sort of basis for how it will work in Linux, at least not until the vendors get their act together and give the developers the acceleration that's needed. They have the knowledge it seems since they did it for Windows, I don't understand why it isn't also also done for Linux. <sigh>

In the meantime the heavy lifting is going to have to be done by the CPU, just as it was on the original XBOX hardware. That means FAST cores and probably more memory. Such is life.

If this were being done for Windows the heavy lifting part of video would be easier but the flexability would be FAR less. <shrug> Personally I'm THRILLED they are as far along as they are and while not a Linux wiz I'm going to play with this while waiting and hoping for an easy to install distro version. When they tell me what hardware to use I WILL buy it!

I totally agree and have been saying this thoughout the forum, on my many boxes we tested cpu is the key and our first set of boxes using dual core amd 64 2x 3800 and 4800 where a no go for smooth playback with our dropped frames... we are moving to a test intel box with one of the new cpu's out and will have results soon, and I do agree with you just because it plays fine on xp dont expect the same playback on linux. If your looking for a good system I would spend the most on the cpu for now and wouldn't count on any optimizations in the near future its not easy work, its all about the decoder.


- rodalpho - 2007-11-26

Nobody answered my question though-- is XBMC/linux really usable on a day to day basis yet?

Again I'm not asking if I should setup a XBMC/linux box at grandma's house. This is for me, and I'm highly tech literate.


- jmarshall - 2007-11-26

Most things work. It can coredump from time to time, but the linux devs are making great progress. I suggest simply trying it for yourself and seeing whether it's usable enough for your needs.


- rodalpho - 2007-11-26

OK, I'll give it a shot when my xbox finally meets its maker. I figure if XBMC isn't ready yet I can live with dualbooting to vista MCE or mediaportal for awhile. MythTV really sucks for media uses.


- yuvalt - 2007-11-26

I'm using it in my living room instead of the XBOX. Working very well.


- runstop - 2007-11-26

I'm using it in my living room as well. Plays 720p content great.. 1080p uses too much cpu so it can drop frames (on my 6000+ amd).. everyday SD xvids work great. so overall, it's way better than the xbox version!


- Razor_109 - 2007-11-26

1nd Question:
i was wondering what about the Intel processors? I only see the AMD named here

from about which type will 1080p be supported under linux?

will the Intel Core™ 2 Duo E4400 be enough? (2x2000mhz / 2048 kB)

or will we be looking at an Intel Core™ 2 Duo E6750? (2x2666mhz / 4096 kB)

I'm running Vista on an Core 2 Duo E6400 and it runs the 1080p .mkv's flawlessly at 30 - 40% without any framedrops. Wondering is this is lowenough to ensure that the E6750 will run the 1080p files on linux under FFmpeg flawlessly too?

2nd Question:
Does the FFdshow-codec compare to the linux FFmpeg? or is there another way to play a 1080p on a windows PC with the decoder from linux? (hope this question makes a little sense, Well my goal is to see whether the E6400 would do fine under linux, without installing linux)


- jmarshall - 2007-11-26

Perhaps mplayer for win32 will bypass using the hw acceleration?


- gateway69 - 2007-11-26

Razor_109 Wrote:1nd Question:


I'm running Vista on an Core 2 Duo E6400 and it runs the 1080p .mkv's flawlessly at 30 - 40% without any framedrops. Wondering is this is lowenough to ensure that the E6750 will run the 1080p files on linux under FFmpeg flawlessly too?

I hate to keep beating this dead horse but xp, and vista decoders are optimized and things are offloaded to the cpu which makes playback of 1080p content much easier on windows, this is not the same for linux *YET* and no idea when this might happen..

We are about to test some intel chips soon, but as i have stated before the get the best cpu for now if you want to play 1080p content with out dropped frames. Also please note this is all work in progress and at some time their might be alot of optimizations that come on line but right now thats not the case.. the guys are working very hard to get this system up and running and have done a great job.


- kabirh - 2007-11-27

So here's the motherboard I'm considering:
GIGABYTE GA-73UM-S2H Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
This board is based on the Nvidia 630i chipset with Nvidia 7150 graphics. It sports HDMI, which according to this thread at phoronix.com, is supported for video under Linux. Audio over HDMI isn't supported in Linux yet AFAIK. The board also has an optical SPDIF header which I hope I can get to work.
It's $100 at newegg.