XBMC for Mac forked for a separate project called PLEX (formarly known as "OSXBMC")

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zAo_OSX Offline
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Post: #1
Quote from Elans blog:
Quote:May 21st, 2008 | Category: Coding | Author: elan
A few days ago, there was a heated internal email discussion going on amongst the XBMC team members. The topic: whether or not to kick me and the other OS X people off the team. There was an actual vote taking place, with retractions, explanations, concessions. One of the OS X people got called a rather offensive name.

I watched this all with a calm sense of detachment. Why? Because I’m totally over it.

When I started porting XBMC to OS X, and then joined up with our little ragtag team of like-minded individuals, the goals were simple: To take what we considered to be the best media center in existence, and make it run on the Mac. The second goal was to make it stable. The third goal was to integrate it fully into the Mac ecosystem. And the fourth goal was to make it even better than it already was.

What became clear to me watching this vote is that these goals can no longer be met as members of Team XBMC. That’s why I voted in favor of kicking us all off the team. I simply do not have the stamina, patience, or desire, to deal with all the drama surrounding our union. I will not go into details here, for the sake of professionalism, and it must be said that I still have a great deal of respect for nearly all of the XBMC team.

Having covered that, where to from here?

We will continue to work on XBMC for the Mac. We are forking the code (it will be hosted on Github). We will still keep roughly in sync with the Linux code, and of course the XBMC team is welcome to merge our changes back into their tree.

The biggest change here is that we will no longer be operating under the restrictions imposed by the team. We can clean up and simplify the settings as we see fit. We can remove features that don’t work right (sometimes, less is more). We can add whatever new features our users are asking for, in the manner of our choosing.

We will be announcing new support forums shortly, and we will be posting details on the Github repository.

Also, we’re definitely looking for talented graphic designers with an eye for typography to work on a top-notch Mac-themed skin.

If you’d like to join us, we’d love to have you. And by “join”, I mean “work with us”. There will be no formal team, nor will there be any getting voted off the team. Think of projects like Mono, Wine, or Linux as models.

It’s an exciting time, and there is a lot more to discuss. Peace out.
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t029248 Offline
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Post: #2
Sad to find this out, stupid that "adults" couldn't see the bigger picture and let this happen. I would like to find out the details why this happened?

I hope the OSX version stays close to the original XBMC, not drifting away too far from the other XBMC versions. At least the fork makes it possible to focus on fully integrating it with OSX without the (legacy) burden / crap for the XBOX / Linux / Windows versions.

For now it's already the Best Media Center for OSX, by far!
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jeremymc7 Offline
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Post: #3
Not sure how I feel about this myself. More details would be helpful, but then it's not my place either.

That said I would prefer it stay as close to all the other versions as possiable for consistancy sake. Obviously there are certain things that need to be tailered to each version though.

Perhaps this will allow a speedier development and better performance with specific Mac tweaking. I just don't want this to too far off course. The last thing I want to see is an official mac version and an unoffical Mac version. It's a waste of resources and creates confusion in the market place.

Just my two cents for what it's worth.
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iordonez Offline
Team Plex
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Post: #4
For you guys much won't change, you will have two choices Team XBMC's OS X release and our release. Our focus will be strictly on mac related functionalities. Source will be available to the XBMC team so you should see some of our features make it into XBMC for OS X and visa versa. All in all it's like your parents separating, they may not be able to live together but they still love you very very much.
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jeremymc7 Offline
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Post: #5
So if the advantage for the OSXBMC group is that they don't have to be tied to the XBMC requirements and can make more specific Mac performance improvements and likely push out updates sooner.

Then whats the advantage for the Team XBMC group and their version?

I'm sure the two versions will be different. But how much, and why? The Team XBMC version sound to be more cut and dry across platforms. Whats the advantage to use their version?
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elupus Offline
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Post: #6
No real advantage for us Sad.
Reason for the split came from that the osx guys were unable to follow the guidlines for development that we had set up. And that one of the guys on ther team managed to alienate most of our developers.

Always read the XBMC online-manual, FAQ and search the forum before posting.
Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting please make sure you read this first.


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adrianc1982 Offline
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Post: #7
iordonez Wrote:For you guys much won't change, you will have two choices Team XBMC's OS X release and our release. Our focus will be strictly on mac related functionalities. Source will be available to the XBMC team so you should see some of our features make it into XBMC for OS X and visa versa. All in all it's like your parents separating, they may not be able to live together but they still love you very very much.

Will we continue to be XBMC or are we going to convert into something else?
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superpea Offline
Team Plex
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Post: #8
Elupus, I don't know if attempting to clarify this is going to benefit anyone, but for the record I just wanted to respond to your comment:
"Reason for the split came from that the osx guys were unable to follow the guidlines for development that we had set up."

I would like to make it clear for the folks who are following this that the catalyst for forking the code is stated in Elan's post here: http://www.osxbmc.com/2008/05/21/exodus/

A key fact here is that TeamXBMC voted to kick the OS X folks off the dev team. They cut my access and another member's access to the TeamXBMC forums / IRC rooms without notification or warning. There was simply no other way to work on the project. The fork enables the OS X folks to continue to work together to do what we have been doing--delivering an awesome XBMC experience on OS X.

One of the benefits of the fork will be to put this bad blood and bickering behind us so we can all get back to work and focus on the awesome platform that the XBMC team has built over the years. I am sure we will both be improving it to each other's (and the USERS!) benefit.

Let's move on.

-superpea
(This post was last modified: 2008-05-22 19:32 by superpea.)
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elupus Offline
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Post: #9
Sooo.. Let's clearify again then..
The reason for why the vote was posted in the first place was what I posted above. Also the vote ended in that they should not be kicked of.

Always read the XBMC online-manual, FAQ and search the forum before posting.
Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
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iordonez Offline
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Post: #10
adrianc1982 Wrote:Will we continue to be XBMC or are we going to convert into something else?

Keep an eye on Elan's blog for more info on that. I really don't want to get into much now, we all agree it's a complete waste of both teams time to argue and will help no one. I will stick around here for a while still providing help until we have our own forums, etc. setup then I'll start phasing out.
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ChoccyHobNob Offline
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Post: #11
I don't think this is good news at all, there are lots of people on both sides of the fork that I like/respect. I don't want to have to split my loyalties and I refuse to do so :-(

I'm a lurker, not a fighter!
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jmarshall Offline
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Post: #12
Disclaimer: This is my personal opinion, it does not represent the views of the team as a whole, and you should not take it as such.

Reason the split happened was primarily because from the start there were separate teams. There was very little effort to develop together (through discussing bugs, features, and regular committing to allow code review and so on), and you can't have a team when you are split. Where the blame lies at this point does not matter, and I expect that both "sides" can accept some portion of it.

What TeamXBMC have gained is we have learnt from the situation, and will simply not allow new developers on the team without clear guidelines of what we expect, so that this sort of thing does not occur again. Better to be clear from the start than have to go through a divorce at a later date Wink

And for the record: The vote went as elupus said. The majority of the team wanted the OSX guys to stay on. It was their decision in the end to leave, and team XBMC knew about it the same time the rest of you did (i.e. when we read elan's blog).

I wish all the OSX team the best, and am sure they'll come up with something nice for you guys, and be assured that I will personally strive to maintain skinengine consistency between the two projects.

Cheers,
Jonathan

Always read the XBMC online-manual, FAQ and search the forum before posting.
Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting please make sure you read this first.


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(This post was last modified: 2008-05-22 22:56 by jmarshall.)
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Jezz_X Offline
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Post: #13
OK well since elan likes to post incomplete summary of details on his website this is the chain of events as I saw it from my vantage point (on the team)that came to this finally (yes this may not be 100% accurate I agree but its pretty close)

teamxbmc : please bring your self tighter into the team and work as one (name, website and so on)
osxbmc : Ignore
teamxbmc : hello did you get that email?
osxbmc : Reply But your delevopment tools suck we want to use our own
teamxbmc : well we will start making changes to our tools to help you better by upgrading to what you want to use
osxbmc : release 1 more binary versions with no source code released
teamxbmc : can you please realease the source code as you release the binary at the same time you realease the new version as its a violation of gpl not too
osxbmc : ignore
osxbmc : released another binary still no source code
teamxbmc : some members who code get very angry and about being ignored about another binary and no source
osxbmc : (in a blog post and not to us) if you want the source send me a pen drive and I will zip it up with goat porn and mail it back at your expense
teamxbmc : even angrer now really starting to fume
osxbmc : ok here I will email it too you if you ask for it
teamxbmc : asked for it got it emailed to some of them
osxbmc : (not elan) come into the team irc channel start basically calling as too sensitive and hypocryts
teamxbmc : (couple of people) really start fuming and are way past angry now and call one of the osx people a name in anger
teamxbmc : decide to take a vote on if we can continue to work with the people (kick off from elans blog yes the orginal team email said kick them off, from one of the very angry people) who will not agree to work to the guidlines that the team has all decided on and worked to for many years now.
osxbmc: (elan) replied with yes kick us off we don't care I can't garentee to commit the source before I release new binary versions
teamxbmc : long discussion on the email end result don't kick them off (one xbmc team member leaves the project because of the decission)
teamxbmc : made a new branch in svn for the osx code so elan can continue to develop it there by himself
osxbmc : week of silence
teamxbmc removed all the access to team stuff for evryone except Elan until it was resolved because 1 osx member just kept making us angry and arguing more
osxbmc : announce on website they are leaving and don't even inform the team of it we have to read it the same way you all did

End we result we are both here

Like I said its my perception from my internal view of the whole thing and may not be accurate
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DonJ Offline
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Post: #14
I haven't been involved much in those discussions and from a fairly neutral point think Jezz_X summarized it quite well.
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elan Offline
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Post: #15
jmarshall Wrote:And for the record: The vote went as elupus said. The majority of the team wanted the OSX guys to stay on.

(I just want to note that regardless of how the vote went, cullman and superpea were summarily tossed off the team by having their access revoked to team forums. So it certainly seemed like some members were voted off the island.)

This has been a rather difficult time for me, and I'd rather not rehash any of the past, but rather focus on the future. I look forward to continue working with you all in a professional and friendly manner. I honestly think this is the best thing for the media center, and the people involved in it.

-elan
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