[Ned Scott]

Dual audio is better handled by the OS or other software. I've had dual audio working on my Linux and OS X XBMC boxes for some time now without any issues.

[Philmatic]

Even if AE in no way touched HD audio codecs, it'd be a hugely important step for the entire program.

Exactly, AE will modularize the audio 'engine' in XBMC and make it that much better and easier to maintain. gnif didn't even create AE with the intention of doing HD Bistreaming, it was just made easier by doing the rewrite in the first place.

I'm a longtime XBMC user (Think XBMP ) and I was disappointed that AE won't make it into Eden, but it doesn't really affect me since I never run stable builds anyway. Once AE is merged into trunk, I'll pull a nightly and be on my merry way.

Since everyone seems to have an opinion, I'll chime in with mine:

One thing that XBMC needs to work on is sharing libraries. MySQL is a good step in that direction, but requiring a central server to host a small database seems like a lot of overkill, not to mention the manual setup required and all that. It doesn't even resolve the thumbnail/cover sharing issue.

I'd like to see a simpler, more modular messaging system (JSON?) built that will sync the databases between XBMC clients in bulk (During large updates) and send simple JSON messages back and forth to update watched/unwatched statuses and to synchronize new additions to the library. I would love to help conceptualize this at a high level and even provide proof of concept code in C#, but since I'm limited to that language (C#, VB.NET and PHP are my specialties), I'm not sure how much I can help with the actual implementation of the code into XBMC.

tl;dr: Shared libraries, shared cover/fanart cache, better audio support (AE) and binary plugins would go a looooooong way into making XBMC a true all in one Media Center application. Skype, Netflix, Hulu, Spotify, and Pandora could all be done through binary plugins, so that solves itself.

PS. Have you thought of prioritizing feature development by public vote, it doesn't have to be binding, but it could help shape the direction of XBMC but seeing what the users (Freeloading bastards, I know) want. You could even charge for votes, that could help buy hardware to develop against.

[darkscout]

The bottom line is, why wouldn't you want the improvements of AE, even if you have no use for HD audio?

Like.... My XBMC is near perfect for my setup by Eden. AirTunes and AirPlay work. It sounds great it does 5.1 out. NFS, AFP, AirTunes, AirPlay, regions, etc. These are things that I can actually "use".

What part of "tehnical nighmare" and "almost impossible to keep both of the streams in sync" is not clear enough?

What part of "we don't care, that's not how we use it" the thread did you not understand?

I've had dual audio working on my Linux and OS X XBMC boxes for some time now without any issues.

Then post in the thread how to do it. Because I haven't seen a way to do it yet with my setup.

[htpc guy]

Then post in the thread how to do it. Because I haven't seen a way to do it yet with my setup.

See this thread http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=62919 for how I got Dual Audio to work in Linux. I posted my results (currently the last post in that thread) with all of my xbmc settings. I used it quite often for some time until my Linux install crashed and I went back to windows.

Hope that helps.

[darkscout]

xbmc config:
- audio output: digital
- dolby digital capable receiver: yes
- dts capable receiver: yes
- audio output: default
- passthrough output device: hdmi
- downmix multichannel audio to stereo: yes (i guess this setting does not matter since ac3/dts is getting passed through to the avr anyway)

result:
- non ac3/dts stereo playback (video, audio) over toslink and hdmi at the same time
- passthrough of ac3/dts signals to my external avr. in this case toslink does not output anything. but that's fine and like it should be.
- navigation sounds on both output devices, hdmi and toslink

So I can't set my TV as a non-pass through device (it doesn't decode AC3/DTS).
I can't stream my AC3/DTS to my receiver.
Every movie I downloaded with 5.1 gets down mixed to Stereo.

[DDDamian]

I'm a longtime XBMC user (Think XBMP ) and I was disappointed that AE won't make it into Eden, but it doesn't really affect me since I never run stable builds anyway. Once AE is merged into trunk, I'll pull a nightly and be on my merry way.

Wow - a pioneer! Can't wait either - built the latest of gnifs work and it's close. It does do the 24-bit out for FLAC and DTS 1500kbps (which is ~24bit/48khz before compression), handles TrueHD, and passes through everything in exclusive mode. Just noticed stuttering on DTS-MA which worked fine in July, so likely ran into some latency issues which gnif mentioned as a problem for dual audio as well. But he had DTS-MA nailed in July so it's do-able.

Remarks like "danced around the apartment when it didn't make Eden" must be like a stab in the heart to gnif who took on the wholesale rewrite of the "A" in AV, as others have mentioned. Even "someone" dead against HD audio called it a major improvement over a "wizened old piece of code that's at least partially a relic of the Xbox days".

Hardly touting the current code.

@darkscout - I'm sure there's a reason why you can't just go HTPC->AVR->TV with your HDMI out and thus get your AC3/DTS for movies and stereo for TV. Your AVR is meant to do what you want if you run your sources to it and will remember your surround preference for TV input or HTPC input. It sounds like you need dual audio because you're running HDMI to the TV and SPDIF to the amp. No HDMI on the AVR? No component out to the TV? Need the best quality picture but don't want anyone else to get the best quality audio? For that you need dual-audio and hope that AE doesn't merge for everyone else?

I'm probably wrong but it's no reason to hope everyone else doesn't get gnifs improvements and dump on them so you can keep the old XBox code in perpetuity in hopes of freezing everything so your dual-audio patch stays compatible forever...
That's outlier, dude - especially in a thread discussing the future of XBMC....

[darkscout]

I got my receiver at Goodwill. It needed some transistors replaced to get out of Protect Mode. It just has HDMI passthrough. Even if it DID pick up the HDMI audio. The TV still can't decode AC3. So I'd get static when playing any movie that had a Passthrough audio sound track.

It wouldn't fit the paradigm of anyone using it for multiple zones.

-

I am waiting with baited breath for the double blind study. Most of the google searches I've found are people asking for the blind study to be done and audio nuts ignoring them.

Until then I will leave you with your Monster™ Gold Plated SPDIF optical connectors, "Pure sine wave" signal conditioners, Vacuum Tubes and 24-bit/48kHz Audio.

And I don't insist on the "best quality" video. Both my TV and Projector only do 720p I notice the difference on older TV shows. But when stuff is getting blowed up. As long as it doesn't artifact I'm happy.

[DDDamian]

@darkscout I suspected it was an AVR issue. Dude I feel for ya, but it's not a reason to dump on people who do want AE or to hope that it doesn't merge.

Yeah, I've got a better setup than you, but my amp (listed in my signature) is not tube, and I think "Monster" cables are beyond my hearing ability to justify although I'd like to own stock as they are overpriced.

But I personally (and many others) can hear the difference in >16/44.1, even on our mid-priced systems, even those with no-name cables. I do play around with gnif's code and notice the improvement 24-bit output makes, as surely as I do in DVDA/SACD or one rock hall to another.

We're talking about the future of XBMC: you have no right to diss me for wanting better than 16-bit, and I have no right to diss you for wanting dual-output. By the time the various excellent suggestions in this thread come to pass maybe I'll have done a double-blind test and you'll have a new amp

[davilla]

Perhaps a better way to think about 'dual audio' is how airtunes works with multiple audio devices and how it even keeps them in sync too. Then instead of dual audio, it's N-audio

[darkscout]

But I personally (and many others) can hear the difference in >16/44.1, even on our mid-priced systems, even those with no-name cables. I do play around with gnif's code and notice the improvement 24-bit output makes, as surely as I do in DVDA/SACD or one rock hall to another.

Double.
Blind.
Study.

Same speakers. Same setup. High end Sure microphones to a DAC or Scope. FFT the result.

44.1kHz is above the Nyquist sampling frequency. Meaning it won't alias anything above 22,050 Hz. 2000 Hz above the nominal range of human hearing. 44/48 makes absolutely no difference other than a minor attenuation difference in the low pass filter.

Fainting Spells respond very well to placebos.

[JustinAiken]

Nyquist means that you can represent 20 KHz with a 44100/s sampling rate; not that it won't be aliased. Whether it's audible to human hearing or not is very debatable, but there will be aliasing.

[darkscout]

Nyquist means that you can represent 20 KHz with a 44100/s sampling rate; not that it won't be aliased. Whether it's audible to human hearing or not is very debatable, but there will be aliasing.

There will be aliasing of frequencies >20,000 Hz. Which is why you toss your low pass filter well above that and know that you aren't aliasing anything you can't hear.

[natethomas]

Well, this has been fun, but I believe we've pretty well covered all the topics people want to cover and are now sufficiently off topic that I'm gonna go ahead and close her down.