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advocate99 · 2014-03-13, 22:26

Presently, XBMC seems to be having an issue with playing content that ServerWMC remuxes (i.e., live tv and active recordings). The skip forward and back and FF and Rew features do not work as expected. In the past, we've seen this attributed to an issue with XBMC.

However, I recently experimented with PlexBMC, which is a plug-in for XBMC that works with Plex Media Server. While it does not remux active recordings, it DOES transcode all of the .wtv files that I watch.

Unlike ServerWMC, however, the FF/Rew and skip forward and skip backward features work as expected when using PlexBMC. For that reason, I suggest that the Devs take a look at how PlexBMC is doing it and attempt to implement the feature the way that they do in an effort to resolve the FF/Rew/Skip issues.

Thanks!

SoCalXMBC · 2014-03-14, 01:28

Can you elaborate for my sake on what doesn't work with ServerWMC? I have no problem skipping forward,back for FF,RW in LiveTV or Recordings so I'm not really sure what problem you are having. Perhaps this is not so much of a global issue as something more specific with the capture card in use.

advocate99 · 2014-03-14, 01:57

Most people, myself included, report that the FF/RW/SKIP work poorly on Live TV/Active Recordings. Existing recordings (which XBMC does not have to Remux) work just fine. I think that I've seen something from either Scarecrow or Krusty on this issue as well.

Just as an example, when you start a Live TV or Active Recording, if you try to skip forward 30 seconds, it will only skip forward by 2-3 seconds. It tends to fix itself the longer you play...

(2014-03-14, 01:28)SoCalXMBC Wrote: Can you elaborate for my sake on what doesn't work with ServerWMC? I have no problem skipping forward,back for FF,RW in LiveTV or Recordings so I'm not really sure what problem you are having. Perhaps this is not so much of a global issue as something more specific with the capture card in use.

krustyreturns · 2014-03-14, 05:13

Interesting. When you watch an 'active' recording with plexbmc does it play all the way to when the scheduled recording stops? or does it just play to what the length of the wtv file was when you started watching? In other words, if only 10 minutes of the file was recorded when you started watching, after you watch it for 10 minutes it just stops.

advocate99 · (This post was last modified: 2014-03-14, 05:36 by advocate99.)

Krusty,

The issue you're talking about is not the issue that I'm talking about. You're referring to the end of file problem, and I'm referring to the Fast Forward/Rewind/Skip Forward Skip Back issue.

Somehow, Plex and PlexBMC have overcome the Fast Forward/Rewind/Skip Forward Skip Back issue when transcoding WTV files.

I'm suggesting that you look into that and incorporate it into ServerWMC, so that when someone is watching Live TV or Active Recordings and when ServerWMC remuxes them, the Fast Forward/Rewind/Skip Forward Skip Back features work correctly.

As far as I know, Plex has no means to accommodate the end of file problem, so ServerWMC is superior in that regard. If you combined PlexBMC's handling of the FF/Rew/Skip problem with ServerWMC's handling of the end of file problem, ServerWMC would be even better...

krustyreturns · 2014-03-14, 06:02

How do you know plex is even transcoding it then? I they aren't dealing with the end of wtv problem, or the 20 minute problem, then they could just be playing the raw wtv, the same thing we do if you turn off 'Remux active recordings'.

Don't get me wrong, if they are transcoding and producing a superior stream format then us I would like to know what they are doing.

advocate99 · (This post was last modified: 2014-03-14, 06:31 by advocate99.)

I believe that PlexBMC transcodes all MPEG2 by default. I'm not even sure if playing raw WTV/MPEG2 is an option. Plex's big selling feature is that you can watch anywhere, and that'd be almost impossible watching MPEG2 raw.

However, I forced it to transcode to 3Mbps at 720p (in the configuration) because I'm watching TV through a VPN from a remote location with insufficient bandwidth to stream .wtv. If it weren't transcoding, I wouldn't be able to watch..

(2014-03-14, 06:02)krustyreturns Wrote: How do you know plex is even transcoding it then? I they aren't dealing with the end of wtv problem, or the 20 minute problem, then they could just be playing the raw wtv, the same thing we do if you turn off 'Remux active recordings'.

Don't get me wrong, if they are transcoding and producing a superior stream format then us I would like to know what they are doing.

advocate99 · 2014-03-14, 06:41

I should add that I'm not sure quite how they do it.

The transcoding is real-time, and much faster than MCE Buddy, and the image quality is excellent.

If you guys could harness the transcoding that Plex uses into ServerWMC so that it transcodes in the background and then deletes the .wtv file when it's done, that'd be pretty cool....

scarecrow420 · 2014-03-14, 14:29

if you take in progress recordings out of the mix, which we've already found that xbmc isnt handling the growing TS file in a nice way... when you spoke about LiveV im not sure I follow... if you are watching LiveTV how can you skip 30 seconds ahead (into the future?)

advocate99 · 2014-03-14, 17:18

First, why would you take in progress recordings out of the mix?

Second, you could start playback of live TV, hit pause for 30 seconds, and then skip forward 30 seconds.

scarecrow420 · (This post was last modified: 2014-03-14, 17:23 by scarecrow420.)

(2014-03-14, 17:18)advocate99 Wrote: First, why would you take in progress recordings out of the mix?

Second, you could start playback of live TV, hit pause for 30 seconds, and then skip forward 30 seconds.

because we already confirmed that there doesnt seem anything wrong with the TS stream and XBMC can jump/skip around in it fine once it isnt growing, but while it is growing, XBMC is not handling it well. we need to seek advice from xbmc video player experts as to what may be the issue, but i would think any fix would be on the XBMC side as we arent really transcoding anything, just repacking the existing data from WTV to TS container

thanks for clarifying the second point. skipping works OK for me on liveTV, its only the remuxed active recordings where i have the issue that XBMC never "sees' more than a few seconds ahead of the current viewing point

advocate99 · (This post was last modified: 2014-03-14, 19:14 by advocate99.)

Scarecrow,

It may just be that XBMC has trouble with streaming Mpeg-2 files, but does not have the same trouble with Mpeg-4.

But, it may also be that Plex does something differently that ServerWMC could borrow from. I'm hoping the latter. FF/Skip always works right with Plex, even when transcoding.

If you guys need any guidance setting up Plex, feel free to PM me. Krusty has my phone #, and you can call me and I'll walk you through it.

I'd also be willing to put up some $$ to get transcoding incorporated into ServerWMC if you guys are interested.

krustyreturns · 2014-03-14, 20:13

I think scarecrow is right that the skip thing is an xbmc problem with our TS file for the case of active wtv, Othereise, I don't know how to explain why the ts files we generate work so long as you aren't playing an active recording. We should pursue getting advice form the xbmc team, somehow....

But I also don't doubt that transcoding to another format could solve problems (and probably introduce new ones). Transcoding has been requested frequently, but there is a lot to research in terms of which open source transcode package would be the best fit and then a lot to code. It would be great to get another developer just to work at that, if anyone reading this is interested. FYI scarecrow and I are helpful and friendly to work with (bit biased) so don't be shy. Since it's a popular request I think we will take it up eventually, but two guys working part time on this, there is a lot of other stuff to do.

On the topic, plex is using a proprietary transcoder (from my 2 minutes of research) won't be much help there.

advocate99 · 2014-03-14, 20:47

I'm only saying that you should look into how PlexBMC does it. It may just be the transcoding, but there may also be something about how the stream is set-up that makes the difference. I'm not a coder, so I have no means to do it...

advocate99 · 2014-03-15, 02:59

I'm watching a recording now from Plex via PlexBMC and am finding that the FF/RW/Skip issues DO appear to occur with files that are being recorded and which are short (i.e. less than 30 minutes).

The solution might be to tell XBMC that the Live TV show or Active Recording is 2 hours long... (even if it isn't).