2006-11-30, 07:59
Re: Spindown HD and Memory usage changing. I also see a similar "pause" in 2.01 when adjusting volume to the video stream that wasn't there in prior versions. Probably a related issue?
Since upgrading to the latest (2.0) versions of XMBC the only thing that's spoiling it is the hard drive spin up on benign operations such as pressing pause.
Like so many other people, my HD makes a fair amount of noise, and also contributes to heating up the whole box. I appreciate the fact that memory is at a premium, and some developers now regret making that feature available.
Personally, I'd gladly sacrifice other features to keep the HD switched off whilst in video playback mode. If it's down to the icons causing the spin up, how about only displaying text when the HD is spun down? This compromise would make a lot of people very happy
Like so many other people, my HD makes a fair amount of noise, and also contributes to heating up the whole box. I appreciate the fact that memory is at a premium, and some developers now regret making that feature available.
Personally, I'd gladly sacrifice other features to keep the HD switched off whilst in video playback mode. If it's down to the icons causing the spin up, how about only displaying text when the HD is spun down? This compromise would make a lot of people very happy
2006-12-20, 18:13
okay, it's time to make this perfectly clear then.
WE WILL NOT CHANGE ANYTHING IN REGARDS TO HDD SPINDOWN.
that is, i'd gladly remove it.
make your dirty compromises yourself, source is in svn.
WE WILL NOT CHANGE ANYTHING IN REGARDS TO HDD SPINDOWN.
that is, i'd gladly remove it.
make your dirty compromises yourself, source is in svn.
2006-12-20, 18:49
Can I just ask... at what point did genuine user feedback become an excuse to be so rude? I'm sorry - but that attitude stinks.
I too use the spin down feature (for all the reasons above). I also find the limitations in the new version a real pain.
I believe this 'problem' of non cached images effecting the spin down occurred in an earlier release - and was at the time kindly addressed. Considering the number of people who are voicing their (genuine) opinion - maybe the development team should reconsider re-including it...
I too use the spin down feature (for all the reasons above). I also find the limitations in the new version a real pain.
I believe this 'problem' of non cached images effecting the spin down occurred in an earlier release - and was at the time kindly addressed. Considering the number of people who are voicing their (genuine) opinion - maybe the development team should reconsider re-including it...
2006-12-20, 20:50
Well said DC. Ofcourse the devs are free to choose what they do. However a good tone should be kept anyways I agree unless he truly consider us morons or something.
The spindown problem was added not long ago. Before that it worked fine, pausing and pressing white button.
If noone capable truly won't do this. Maybe they could do something like (as an option ofcourse):
If HD _is_ spun down:
Paused: Write PAUSED with text on screen instead of the graphics.
White Button: Write 00:05:37 / 01:47:05 in text also.
Trust me I rather have the limited amount of graphics available while playing back video. And I do not understand there are memory issues here. My LCD shows Free mem and there are always pleanty - enough for these small bitmaps I think.
Why is it needed to unload all graphics and not just keep the minimum? Please enlighten us
The spindown problem was added not long ago. Before that it worked fine, pausing and pressing white button.
If noone capable truly won't do this. Maybe they could do something like (as an option ofcourse):
If HD _is_ spun down:
Paused: Write PAUSED with text on screen instead of the graphics.
White Button: Write 00:05:37 / 01:47:05 in text also.
Trust me I rather have the limited amount of graphics available while playing back video. And I do not understand there are memory issues here. My LCD shows Free mem and there are always pleanty - enough for these small bitmaps I think.
Why is it needed to unload all graphics and not just keep the minimum? Please enlighten us
2006-12-20, 22:30
The following things are spooled off disk:
1. All textures and skin xml files.
2. All database related features (eg bookmark times, resume times, video settings, etc. etc. etc.)
3. All settings features (when they change they must be written to disk)
4. All fonts (TTF) are loaded per-letter, on demand.
As spiff has said - many of the developers (I can't speak for all) have no intention of changing this, because of a simple reason: It has never worked well, and introduces many "special-casing" things that are difficult to maintain.
May I suggest a simple fix for you users with harddisks that are obviously far noisier than the average: Remove all textures from the skin files for this (VideoFullscreen.xml), and make sure the seek dialog does not popup on pause (DialogSeekBar.xml). I can't guarantee that that will fix things, but it's a start.
Cheers,
Jonathan
1. All textures and skin xml files.
2. All database related features (eg bookmark times, resume times, video settings, etc. etc. etc.)
3. All settings features (when they change they must be written to disk)
4. All fonts (TTF) are loaded per-letter, on demand.
As spiff has said - many of the developers (I can't speak for all) have no intention of changing this, because of a simple reason: It has never worked well, and introduces many "special-casing" things that are difficult to maintain.
May I suggest a simple fix for you users with harddisks that are obviously far noisier than the average: Remove all textures from the skin files for this (VideoFullscreen.xml), and make sure the seek dialog does not popup on pause (DialogSeekBar.xml). I can't guarantee that that will fix things, but it's a start.
Cheers,
Jonathan
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Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting please make sure you read this first.
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2006-12-21, 00:18
Thanks man for the info man
1. I do not know how this is loaded in to memory, all at a time or just the ones needed. If some sort of list is used, maybe items could be marked with a simple flag "KeepInMemory" and this flag could be cleared when B is pressed. Only the really nice to have textures for usual video nagivation.
2. I understand this is needed for some of the features like bookmarks, but resume time could just be written when harddrive is powered on which it is when B is pressed to stop the movie. Video settings, see 3.
3. I understand this is needed and ofcourse here it's ok to power on hdd.
4. See 1. Keep the TTF's needed for basic video navigation in memory.
I do not know how anything has been implemented. I am a dev myself, but sadly lack the time to get into the code, but I am under the impression that the code base is very tight and nicely written. It's just hard to accept that this is totally impossible. Wish I hadn't bought that damn 400 gb 7200 rpm hitachi disk. Slow to power on and very noisy when on...
1. I do not know how this is loaded in to memory, all at a time or just the ones needed. If some sort of list is used, maybe items could be marked with a simple flag "KeepInMemory" and this flag could be cleared when B is pressed. Only the really nice to have textures for usual video nagivation.
2. I understand this is needed for some of the features like bookmarks, but resume time could just be written when harddrive is powered on which it is when B is pressed to stop the movie. Video settings, see 3.
3. I understand this is needed and ofcourse here it's ok to power on hdd.
4. See 1. Keep the TTF's needed for basic video navigation in memory.
I do not know how anything has been implemented. I am a dev myself, but sadly lack the time to get into the code, but I am under the impression that the code base is very tight and nicely written. It's just hard to accept that this is totally impossible. Wish I hadn't bought that damn 400 gb 7200 rpm hitachi disk. Slow to power on and very noisy when on...
2006-12-21, 00:48
Textures are spooled on demand. We'd have to special-case it so that they were loaded once only. Same with fonts - the TTF library would have to be special-cased to allow the font file to be in memory rather than on disk, or all letters required would have to be cached. Obviously this would apply also to the subtitle font, which is not an insignificant amount of memory, particularly for asian languages.
I never said it was impossible. Merely that it is not easy. Some operations should force the harddisk out of spindown, some should not - knowing which is which is non-obvious.
Cheers,
Jonathan
I never said it was impossible. Merely that it is not easy. Some operations should force the harddisk out of spindown, some should not - knowing which is which is non-obvious.
Cheers,
Jonathan
Always read the XBMC online-manual, FAQ and search the forum before posting.
Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting please make sure you read this first.
Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting please make sure you read this first.
Registered to post in this thread. Been using XMBC for 2 years or so. It seems odd that a feature would be introduced (spindown) and then a new feature is introduced later (pretty gui during video) which introduces a bug to the other feature and the responce is 'oh well.'
IMHO the spindown is a much more important feature than the pretty gui. It's quieter and prolongs the life of the drive. But that shouldn't be an issue, loading up a portion of the gui+icons, and the fonts and strings shouldn't be an issue. I'm sure almost everyone would be ok with xmbc using an extra meg or 2 of ram. This seems like it would be a good idea anyway so it wouldn't have to seek the harddrive for every little thing.
One of the things that people often complain about open source software is when people ask for a feature often the response is 'do it yourself'. If someone did do it themselves would you guys add it to the trunk (assuming it was neat and didn't break anything, etc)?
IMHO the spindown is a much more important feature than the pretty gui. It's quieter and prolongs the life of the drive. But that shouldn't be an issue, loading up a portion of the gui+icons, and the fonts and strings shouldn't be an issue. I'm sure almost everyone would be ok with xmbc using an extra meg or 2 of ram. This seems like it would be a good idea anyway so it wouldn't have to seek the harddrive for every little thing.
One of the things that people often complain about open source software is when people ask for a feature often the response is 'do it yourself'. If someone did do it themselves would you guys add it to the trunk (assuming it was neat and didn't break anything, etc)?
2007-01-09, 10:48
Would someone be able to tell me where I can find what the last version of XBMC was that didn't have this problem. I would be willing to revert to it.
I predominantly us XBMC to stream recorded TV from a PC, and the pause is very annoying.
As for the noise issue, most other things in my lounge are quiet enough that you can hear the HDD. Especially at night.
I predominantly us XBMC to stream recorded TV from a PC, and the pause is very annoying.
As for the noise issue, most other things in my lounge are quiet enough that you can hear the HDD. Especially at night.
2007-02-03, 13:43
jmarshall Wrote:The following things are spooled off disk:
May I suggest a simple fix for you users with harddisks that are obviously far noisier than the average: Remove all textures from the skin files for this (VideoFullscreen.xml), and make sure the seek dialog does not popup on pause (DialogSeekBar.xml). I can't guarantee that that will fix things, but it's a start.
Johnothan, I finally got around to making a quick edit to the DialogSeekBar.xml and it has solved HDD spin up problem. So I no longer have any delays associated with the HDD spin up, or any noise.
Thanks for the tip. I appreciate it.
Adrian
2007-02-04, 11:32
adrian, care to share what you did exactly?
jm, it would be nice if this was an option for those with slow disks
jm, it would be nice if this was an option for those with slow disks
