[Jagsta]

Mystery solved, with either limited,limited or full,full, the contrast and brightness settings on the projector were too high and low respectively to show the black or white bars in the clipping samples, hence me thinking they were being crushed (i'd tuned the settings with limited,full as the configuration as that's the first setting i'd found with no banding).

Full,full shows banding, so i've now settled on limited/limited, no banding, no crush with the modified brightness/contrast settings, BTB and WTW clipped.

Thanks for questioning the sanity of my original configuration.

[john.cord]

That is why beightness and contrast are the first two steps in everey display calibration.

Gesendet von meinem Nexus 5 mit Tapatalk

[LB06]

What is the purpose of WtW and BtB (regarding 'making calibration easier' and PQ in general)? I.e. what is the difference, PQ wise, between FFF and LFL?

What I do know is that LFL will unavoidably create some banding in "native" RGB content such as the GUI and the artwork.

[noggin]

What is the purpose of WtW and BtB (regarding 'making calibration easier' and PQ in general)? I.e. what is the difference, PQ wise, between FFF and LFL?

BTB and WTW (i.e. <16 and >235 or >240 Y/CbCr respectively) are there to avoid clipping overshoots and undershoots - which are often present in analogue-sourced signals (*) and can also be introduced by filtering processes. If you clip transients you can introduce ringing on them downstream (i.e. artificial edge artefacts) In an ideal world they should be preserved, not clipped.

(*) Although you might think analogue sources are limited to ancient composite PAL/NTSC SD stuff, in reality some HD camera systems used in the broadcast chain use a high-quality analogue connection between the camera and the studio control room (though these shouldn't really introduce overshoot/undershoot transients)

[rukusx7]

For those of you with Samsung televisions and raspberry Pi boards, this is what I've found.

Okay, sounds like ycbcr is off the table. Good.

If you set pixel encoding on the pi to RGB " Limited" expect to set your Samsung HDMI black level to "low"

If you set pixel encoding on the pi to RGB "full", then you can expect to set HDMI black level to "normal"

[rukusx7]

After going over my thoughts again, it appears that with my television, it's best RGB full / normal. With limited / low there is gradient in a grey scale image. Check it out for yourself.

[mbze430]

I have Kodi/DSPLayer (PC) @ 0-255 -> MadVR @ 0-255 -> Nvidia GPU @ 0-255 -> Samsung KS8000 (Normal 0-255)

According to the OP chart this is correct. GREAT!

However using the AVS 709 Black Level pattern. Am I supposed to set brightness level to 16 as reference black or am I supposed to set 0 = black.

Either way. need to know in a ALL 0-255, am I still setting 16 as reference black or am I suppose to set 5 to black (6 blinking)?

Note: with Full 0-255 all across turning up the entire brightness level to max, I can only see up to 6 blinking, beyond that looks "black" (grey at this point)

However if I set 16-235, 0-255, 16-235, using the same black level pattern I can see all the way to 1 that is blinking.

[mombasa123]

Setup is Windows 10 PC, Intel HD GPU and Samsung 55inch top end TV.

I have been playing with the various options listed but the first 2 settings (Full->Full->Full and Full->Full->Limited do not correlate with what I am seeing.

Full->Full->Full gives me washed out colours instead of clipping
Full->Full->Limited gives correct colours no clipping

I have currently set it up as the recommended Limited->Full->Limited which gives correct colours/levels but i see some slight banding on GreyScale Ramp.

Thing is, my Intel HD GPU has Input AND Output RGB Settings which this discussion doesn't factor in? For now, I match the Input setting to the Kodi setting when I am going through the various combinations, ie if Kodi is set to limited, I set the Intel Input RGB to limited.

So in my current setup i have Kodi (Limited)-> Intel Input (Limited)->Intel Output (Full)->TV (Low/Limited)

Is that the correct thing to do or should the Intel GPU be set to Full/Full for passthrough? Think I tried that and got washed out colours but all got a bit confusing late at night

Any thoughts please?

Thanks.

Edit : I just tried the above and levels blow up so looks like Intel GPU should be set to same as Kodi output.

In summary, for me, the 2 settings that work are :
Limited->Full->Limited
Full->Full->Limited

Both have correct levels with no clipping. However there is slight banding on Greyscale Ramp (compared to my RP3i which is damn near perfect in default config). Also, i noticed a small difference in black levels with the 1st setting above having Level 17 more visible than the 2nd setting. Not sure which one is supposed to be better.

Hmmm ...

[blob810]

I have also a Intel GPU. The HD610. The best Settings for me is Full Full Limited. 

When i set it To Limited Full Limited The Black Bars in The Videos with HEVC Codec are more grey instead of Black.

[GrammatonKlerik]

I have also a Intel GPU. The HD610. The best Settings for me is Full Full Limited. 

When i set it To Limited Full Limited The Black Bars in The Videos with HEVC Codec are more grey instead of Black.

For those using Intel GPU on a Windows OS install MadVR and use the MadLevelsTweaker.exe to force your GPU to output in Full levels. Make sure to reboot once you check the box and apply. This was the only way to get my Intel HD4000 GPU to output in Full levels regardless what the Intel Control Panel said.

I think this may be what is causing you guys some odd issues where Full -> Full -> Limited appears to be giving you correct levels when in fact you’re really doing Full -> Limited -> Limited which *will* give you correct levels but at the expense of double scaling.

[KrispyKreme]

I have an Intel pc 2820 and I did Limited Full Limited and works great but I have to turn off hardware acceleration because with it on it clips BTB and WTW. With hardware acceleration off, my videos skip and have trouble playing now. I noticed on the first post that the BTB/WTW would be fixed with hardware acceleration in the Kodi 17. Was that delayed or am I doing something wrong? I went back to Full-Full-Full which is fine but I do notice banding on videos which i don't like. Any help would be great. thanks guys

[noggin]

I have an Intel pc 2820 and I did Limited Full Limited and works great but I have to turn off hardware acceleration because with it on it clips BTB and WTW. With hardware acceleration off, my videos skip and have trouble playing now. I noticed on the first post that the BTB/WTW would be fixed with hardware acceleration in the Kodi 17. Was that delayed or am I doing something wrong? I went back to Full-Full-Full which is fine but I do notice banding on videos which i don't like. Any help would be great. thanks guys

@fritsch can confirm but there was originally one route to do this :

1. Set output to Full (i.e. 0-255) not Limited - which is counterintuitive at the OS / Driver level (i.e. in xrandr.conf) 
2. Within Kodi enable the Limited 16-235 output levels option.

What this does is cheat - it uses the Intel GPU / Driver in Full 0-255 mode (so the drivers passes everything it is presented - assuming black is 0 and white is 255). However Kodi doesn't send 0-255 video with the Limited 16-235 option enabled, and so Kodi is sending black at 16 and white at 235 - but BTB and WTW <16 and >235 content is also sent and passed through).  This works - but has implications in other areas if you are using a general Linux distro.

From memory fritsch and/or his colleagues implemented an additional option in xrandr which removed this requirement - but I don't know if it is still implemented OR needed.

[KrispyKreme]

I have an Intel pc 2820 and I did Limited Full Limited and works great but I have to turn off hardware acceleration because with it on it clips BTB and WTW. With hardware acceleration off, my videos skip and have trouble playing now. I noticed on the first post that the BTB/WTW would be fixed with hardware acceleration in the Kodi 17. Was that delayed or am I doing something wrong? I went back to Full-Full-Full which is fine but I do notice banding on videos which i don't like. Any help would be great. thanks guys

@fritsch can confirm but there was originally one route to do this :

1. Set output to Full (i.e. 0-255) not Limited - which is counterintuitive at the OS / Driver level (i.e. in xrandr.conf) 
2. Within Kodi enable the Limited 16-235 output levels option.

What this does is cheat - it uses the Intel GPU / Driver in Full 0-255 mode (so the drivers passes everything it is presented - assuming black is 0 and white is 255). However Kodi doesn't send 0-255 video with the Limited 16-235 option enabled, and so Kodi is sending black at 16 and white at 235 - but BTB and WTW <16 and >235 content is also sent and passed through).  This works - but has implications in other areas if you are using a general Linux distro.

From memory fritsch and/or his colleagues implemented an additional option in xrandr which removed this requirement - but I don't know if it is still implemented OR needed.  

 This is technically how I have and there is no problems except I have to turn off hardware acceleration in order to pass BTB and WTW on a test pattern which causes problems for videos and movies I play. I can set Full on my Intel Graphic settings with no issues at all. Kodi setting is on Limited.

[Roby77]

Tried to search but didn't find updated info,

See here that Milhouse says that something is changed

https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid...pid2700654

It's always for intel gpu best video setting for film mode

Kodi limited (16-235 activated) , gpu set in automatic and TV set in limited ?

(And check with Cal test clipping, gray scale ramp etc)

It's better to set gpu in full instead of automatic ? Or for intel full is default ?

Xrandr --verbose report gpu in Automatic

Xrandr --prop report gpu in full

[demoncamber]

So guys, has this changed at all? Is this the current recommended config still? Or is everything working? And what about amd cpu gpu?