Unified PVR frontend (DVR/HTPC client GUI with EPG) and Addons API for PVR backends?

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hudo Offline
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Post: #226
Hmmm.

I don't have any issues watching TV on my XBMC box using pvr-testing2 branch. There are a few glitches and bugs but that's to be expected from unstable/in development software.

I can see 'Sly' and a bunch of other providers using 2x HVR4000. You just have to find the best solution... Wink

BTW, I have owned countless dreamboxes over the years and the latest models (800/8000) still can't get close to a proper configured XBMC. I still own 2 but I'm seriously considering ditching them after pvr branch is merged into trunk and stabilized.

Unless you just want to watch TV - in that case it's a great product - media watching/listening on dreamboxes is a joke... a bad taste joke for a product that *could* be great. That's what you gain for closing the source on kernel/drivers/whatever level...

However I will concede on this: TV functionality on dreamboxes is the best. I have a list of things to put on trac tickets to mimic dreamboxes functionality. Their navigation system through channels is unbeatable. 5 keys give you all the control you'll ever need.

hudo
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Vultures Offline
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Post: #227
Quote:I don't have any issues watching TV on my XBMC box using pvr-testing2 branch. There are a few glitches and bugs but that's to be expected from unstable/in development software.
I can see 'Sly' and a bunch of other providers using 2x HVR4000. You just have to find the best solution...

I assume by the best solution you mean CS? Well, that's an option. But I was talking about legal ways to get there Wink
Anyway, I'd like to hear about your solution. And about PVR testing branch (where can one get it and is there anything for Enigma2)
My point is that Enigma2 boxes are the best option for TV back-end for XBMC. Reasons why:
-Ability to mix dvb-t, dvb-s, and dvb-c in one box (DM8000), and eventually in your HTPC.
-Multiple tuners — you can watch your services on multiple XBMC clients around the house (up to 4 and more with some limitations for DM8000).
-Unlimited number of cards/subscriptions — when you run out of built in card readers, you use 4 CI interfaces, if that's not enough, you can install usb smargo readers.
-Client APIs, web interface, and HTTP streaming are already in place, and quite mature.
-Almost all providers are supported. It's hard to impossible to activate certain subscriptions on DVB cards, especially on windows PC. On DM it's quite straighforward.
-Wide range of well-supported software cams for those who need it.
-Can be dirt cheap thanks to child labor from China. Seriously, clones are almost as good as the "real thing", given that you don't plan to update it too often — every update is a risk of bricking.
-You even have a phoneline for interactive services.
Et cetera, et cetera.

PS: You can't sort channel list based on frequency. That's bad. Otherwise they are perfect.
But I am still looking forward to integration with XBMC, that would be kinda all in one godboxBig Grin
(This post was last modified: 2010-09-27 17:56 by Vultures.)
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Vultures Offline
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Post: #228
hudo Wrote:Unless you just want to watch TV - in that case it's a great product - media watching/listening on dreamboxes is a joke... a bad taste joke for a product that *could* be great. That's what you gain for closing the source on kernel/drivers/whatever level...
hudo

That is why I raised this suggestion. Dreambox is not by all means a media player, you can make one from it using VLC server, but it would be nothing compared to regular HTPC, not to mention XBMC. But they could become a perfect couple with proper inegration, see above.
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hudo Offline
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Post: #229
I agree to all the above, but there's no reason why one can't do all that with several tuner cards, a server and a few front-ends, instead of just buying a bunch of dreamboxes - they will never be a true media-center - and xbmc boxes to accompany them.

Considering the price tag on a DM8000, you can build a server and 2 or more front-ends (depending on hardware used, of course...)

And you still end up with a better product. As for the child labor... I prefer not to buy Chinese cloned stuff (I know, I know... almost impossible task...). You end up with a good looking brick on your hands with a not so nice price tag...

Anyways, this is just discussing possibilities.

My current setup is:

- Server/main XBMC box on living room (Asus M3N78-EM, BE-2350, 2Gigs RAM, etc) with 2x HVR4000 and an experimental DVB-T usb stick that my TV provider offered to convince me on switching from sat... Not happening for reasons that don't matter here.

- 2 x Asrock 330 as front-ends connected to server

They all run XBMC pvr branch that you can get here: https://launchpad.net/~henningpingel/+archive/xbmc

Beware it's usable but *not* stable. And support on xbmc forums for that branch is only available after it's been merged into trunk.

hudo
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Vultures Offline
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Post: #230
hudo Wrote:there's no reason why one can't do all that with several tuner cards, a server and...
...a bunch of phoenix readers, Linux, but not just any linux, cardserver software, that are pain to setup. There are also driver and compatibility issues issues, etc, etc.
The above is mostly about nasty NDS3 cards, but nearly all the cool stuff is encrypted with NDS these days. You can use CS on your sever, but CS sucks for Sly (I know that using L is a stupid superstition, but what the hell). You need a rocksolid connection, 100% reliable server, and totally transparent trace to make it work.
DM8000 is some 700 euros (850 with addon tuners). Server with similair capabilities will cost about the same. Certainly not less (4 tuner cards, 2 cardreaders, 4 CIs, wi-fi etc.)
But dream gives it to you without particular pain. And it is EASY to integrate with xbmc.
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hudo Offline
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Post: #231
Ok.

It's a matter of taste and how much one can achieve with less $$.
To my needs, a server with two tuner cards, a cardreader or two and low end hardware (like my server/main xbmc) makes it, including HD content.

I do agree that for the average user, configuring all this vs connecting to a dreambox with a fancy add-on is an easy choice. Add-on always hands down!

Again, I agree that dreamboxes are excellent live TV providers. But to me, the less boxes I have under my TV sets, the better.

It takes me less than an hour to proper configure everything I need on my server from starting ubuntu minimal install to a fully working system, including cardreaders, vdr, xbmc and a few other things.

Again, it's a matter of taste. And I really like to mess with software and hardware... but that's just me! Wink

hudo
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Vultures Offline
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Post: #232
May be some devs or decision makers will provide an update. Ticket #10185 I opened regarding the matter was moved to Eden milestone, but it wasn't accepted or assigned (12 days), so I am beginning to wonder...

I hope my first posts with all the pros are not too deep=)

2 hudo: If you have three or more official cards, three or more clients (don't tell me you don't have TV in the bathroom), server becomes too much of a pain. For my tastes of course. Besides, once you set it up you may end up buying collocation in Ukraine to share your cards around Europe to make $$Big Grin
(This post was last modified: 2010-09-27 19:18 by Vultures.)
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hudo Offline
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Post: #233
No TV on bathroom... yet!Big Grin

As for cs, I share with my 3 brothers on 3 different countries, and they share with me. But you're right! I could earn some $$ with it. I just don't want to. I'm all for earning some bucks, but I like my freedom a lot...

@tafypz
Sorry I missed your post but a rather interesting call was made today by @dteirney:

http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=82015
http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=82017

Hope you can find what you are looking for.

hudo
(This post was last modified: 2010-09-27 23:16 by hudo.)
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LehighBri Offline
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Post: #234
Just started dabbling with XBMC and very interesting for me to follow the PVR development. I'm a big supporter of SageTV and have been using it for years and they continue to evolve the product quite nicely. It doesn't have the "polish" of XBMC but the functionality plus their HD200/HD300 extenders is hard to beat.

Now that XBMC seems to be including PVR functionality in their next major 11.0 (Eden) release, is the intent to compete directly with SageTV or is the intent to built some API that could allow integration with SageTV? Just trying to understand how this fits with SageTV, if at all.
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matejdro Offline
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Post: #235
Most TV applications have 2 parts: one that manages TV signals (back-end) and another that shows interface (front-end).

XBMC just have front-end, which means it still needs application in background that will manage TV signals and send them to XBMC.

I don't know SageTV, so i can't tell you if it's compatible.
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hudo Offline
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Post: #236
Look on Eden roadmap to have an idea of what's planned about pvr capabilities:http://trac.xbmc.org/roadmap

As always, roadmap is a guideline to developers intention, not a compromise...

spiff will bite you Big Grin if you start ranting about what it should do instead of helping with what you can.

hudo
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aaronb Offline
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Post: #237
SageTV is closed-source, but there is a very good API for interacting with it, I see no reason why there cannot be SageTV/XBMC integration. In the meantime I've been working on a SageTV add-on that works in Dharma, I have the basics working just fine (listing and playing shows, with plot/genre/etc displayed using one of the episode view types from the TV Show library).

More info here: http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=80868

I don't have the most recent code in the thread, I can add it later tonight or tomorrow.
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Harry Muscle Offline
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Question  What is the current status of the unified PVR front-end (a.k.a. pvr-testing2 branch)?
Post: #238
Just wondering if anyone in the know would be able to provide a bit of an update on the status of the Unified PVR Front End that's been in development for a while (also known as the PVR Testing Branch).

Reason I ask is because I'm toying with the idea of integrating Slingbox support into XBMC (based on the Slingbox SDK found here: http://sourceforge.net/projects/slingboxsdk/). So I have three avenues that I can choose. Create something similar to the HDHomeRun support and integrate Slinbox into XBMC that way. Or if the PVR testing branch is far enough along create a Slingbox PVR Addon for the PVR branch. Or if the PVR branch still has lots of work left on it, just sit back and wait for all the PVR stuff to get wrapped up.

Any and all input/feedback is much appreciated.

Thanks,
Harry
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lloydsmart Offline
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Post: #239
Well, IANAdev, but I'd think that a PVR addon would be the way to go, since this seems to be the way things are headed. If I'm not mistaken it's pretty much a given that once the code is stable and complete enough that it'll be merged into xbmc trunk, so it would make a lot of sense to write an addon in this way.

I'd wait for input from an actual team-xbmc'er first, though. I'm just speculating. Smile
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Harry Muscle Offline
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Post: #240
lloydsmart Wrote:Well, IANAdev, but I'd think that a PVR addon would be the way to go, since this seems to be the way things are headed. If I'm not mistaken it's pretty much a given that once the code is stable and complete enough that it'll be merged into xbmc trunk, so it would make a lot of sense to write an addon in this way.

I'd wait for input from an actual team-xbmc'er first, though. I'm just speculating. Smile

I wonder though, since PVR is Personal Video Recorder and the Slingbox doesn't do any recording, it's simply a video feed source, more like the HDHomeRun which as far as I can tell is currently supported as simply an extra video source when adding video sources. Hmm ....

Harry
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