[wrxtasy]

I've yet to see any motion processing on a consumer display that doesn't introduce artefacts (particularly on complex motion on more heavily compressed sources like OTT streaming platforms, where compression artefacts confuse the motion interpolation algorithms)

Well I'm going to disagree with you because my "Consumer Display" 2019 Panasonic OLED has not throw out any glaring picture artifacts during regular 25fps Netflix U.K. / European / Oz produced video streaming. Modern Sony Picture Processing & Motion Support is at least, just as good.

However when it comes to 25p, poorly encoded replays of sports, which frankly is a horrible combo when viewed on everything.
Yes that is where I see glaring picture artifacts with even minor Motion Interpolation enabled. Even on Kodi devices that do auto Frame Rate Matching.

If OTT platforms are internet streaming fast action sports at a lowly 25p. Well that is the root cause of the problem and really consumers should avoid such video streams in the very first place.

[noggin]

I've yet to see any motion processing on a consumer display that doesn't introduce artefacts (particularly on complex motion on more heavily compressed sources like OTT streaming platforms, where compression artefacts confuse the motion interpolation algorithms)

Well I'm going to disagree with you because my "Consumer Display" 2019 Panasonic OLED has not throw out any glaring picture artifacts during regular 25fps Netflix U.K. / European / Oz produced video streaming. Modern Sony Picture Processing & Motion Support is at least, just as good.

Don't the Panasonic OLED range frame-rate switch with Netflix - I thought they did? We are talking about the Sony range that doesn't.

I'll just repeat - I've yet to see any 25/50->60fps consumer conversions, particularly on heavily compressed OTT stuff with compression artefacts, that don't get confused by compression artefacts, or complex motion.  It gets even worse when one picture area has two motion vectors (when semi-transparent animated graphics appear on sports coverage for instance), on rotational motion (where regular block-matching fails as it doesn't trial alternative orientations, just lateral translations) or on fast pans across crowds.  Tennis balls also challenge the interpolation used... (Amazon Prime has a LOT of live tennis in the UK)

However when it comes to 25p, poorly encoded replays of sports, which frankly is a horrible combo when viewed on everything.
Yes that is where I see glaring picture artifacts with even minor Motion Interpolation enabled. Even on Kodi devices that do auto Frame Rate Matching.
If OTT platforms are internet streaming fast action sports at a lowly 25p. Well that is the root cause of the problem and really consumers should avoid such video streams in the very first place.

A lot of UK OTT sports streaming is 50fps not 25fps. Amazon Prime, Eurosport Player etc. are all 50fps not 25fps for sport these days. (Prime switched to 50fps very early, Eurosport took ages.)

[noggin]

@noggin can you give a few example of European 25p/50p shows in netflix which I can try to test in my CX built in app to see if I notice any issues with it or not.

I notice judder (or stutter, always get confused between the 2!) on Netflix dolby vision content during panning shots (which were practically non existant on my plasma, in general I mean as I didn't have hdr at all before obviously) and at times for certain SDR content too but so far I don't notice any frame drops which I believe can happen when you have mismatched frame rate of the show and screen?

Just chosing some series at random on my ATV 4K via my AVR (which reports input frame rate) - The Crown (Series 3 is the one I checked) on Netflix is 25fps, Occupied (Norwegian series) is 25fps, Young Wallander (Swedish series in English) is 25fps and gorgeous HDR (Though it was shot in Lithuania and definitely doesn't look like Sweden in places).  Pretty much any BBC series will be 25fps too.

Series 2 of The Grand Tour on Prime is 25fps. (Series 1 was 24fps I think)

However the judder you are seeing may be based around a difference between the way OLED and Plasma display pictures. Plasmas didn't actually dim their pixels - the pixels were either on or off, so they achieved grey scale by using 'sub-fields' to increase the refresh rate of the display to 300Hz or higher, and then only illuminated pixels for some sub-fields and not others to create an illusion of grey scale. OLEDs are able to actually vary the brightness of their pixels, and do so very 'cleanly'.  The way the brain thus perceives motion and judder may well differ between the two technologies.  It may be that OLED makes the inherent temporal judder that low frame rate 24 and 25fps capture uses more noticeable.  I know there has been some research done into different display tech and the way it changes perception of this stuff.

[jambono]

This post earlier from @88keyz is correct:
https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid...pid2968593
https://twitter.com/androidtv_rumor/stat...2907161602

The 2020 X800H model has a Realtek RTD2873 SoC that includes a quad Core ARM [email protected] and a ARM Mali G31 GPU.
That G31 GPU is pretty good so the X800H should still be a responsive setup. It's the same GPU that the new snappy GoogleTV dongle uses.

Rtings(click) calls Android TV and Apps usage on the X800H, "Very Smooth"

If you want to compare RAW CPU numbers for the 2019 X850G (UR2) vs the 2020 X800H (VU1):
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/com...e=11425334

Hey sorry but I just bought the X800H (X80H) and it come with MediaTek 5893 SoC, this is what Aida64 show me so you wrong this device do NOT come with any Realtek RTD2873 but MediaTek 5893 SoC (I bought the 65") like displayspecifications say

[jambono]

@88keyz
I just bought the X800H (X80H) and it come with MediaTek 5893 SoC, this is what Aida64 show me... You wrong this device do NOT come with any Realtek RTD2873... the 800H (X80H) come with MediaTek 5893 SoC (I bought the 65" at Costco just now) like displayspecifications say

[wrxtasy]

This post earlier from @88keyz is correct:
https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid...pid2968593
https://twitter.com/androidtv_rumor/stat...2907161602

The 2020 X800H model has a Realtek RTD2873 SoC that includes a quad Core ARM [email protected] and a ARM Mali G31 GPU.
That G31 GPU is pretty good so the X800H should still be a responsive setup. It's the same GPU that the new snappy GoogleTV dongle uses.

Rtings(click) calls Android TV and Apps usage on the X800H, "Very Smooth"

If you want to compare RAW CPU numbers for the 2019 X850G (UR2) vs the 2020 X800H (VU1):
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/com...e=11425334

Hey sorry but I just bought the X800H (X80H) and it come with MediaTek 5893 SoC, this is what Aida64 show me so you wrong this device do NOT come with any Realtek RTD2873 but MediaTek 5893 SoC (I bought the 65") like displayspecifications say

I would not worry it’s the same MediaTek chipset Sony puts in their expensive Premium 2020 X950H model TV. So it’s even better vs a Realtek.
So all good !

[ars92]

@noggin can you give a few example of European 25p/50p shows in netflix which I can try to test in my CX built in app to see if I notice any issues with it or not.

I notice judder (or stutter, always get confused between the 2!) on Netflix dolby vision content during panning shots (which were practically non existant on my plasma, in general I mean as I didn't have hdr at all before obviously) and at times for certain SDR content too but so far I don't notice any frame drops which I believe can happen when you have mismatched frame rate of the show and screen?

Just chosing some series at random on my ATV 4K via my AVR (which reports input frame rate) - The Crown (Series 3 is the one I checked) on Netflix is 25fps, Occupied (Norwegian series) is 25fps, Young Wallander (Swedish series in English) is 25fps and gorgeous HDR (Though it was shot in Lithuania and definitely doesn't look like Sweden in places).  Pretty much any BBC series will be 25fps too.

Series 2 of The Grand Tour on Prime is 25fps. (Series 1 was 24fps I think)

However the judder you are seeing may be based around a difference between the way OLED and Plasma display pictures. Plasmas didn't actually dim their pixels - the pixels were either on or off, so they achieved grey scale by using 'sub-fields' to increase the refresh rate of the display to 300Hz or higher, and then only illuminated pixels for some sub-fields and not others to create an illusion of grey scale. OLEDs are able to actually vary the brightness of their pixels, and do so very 'cleanly'.  The way the brain thus perceives motion and judder may well differ between the two technologies.  It may be that OLED makes the inherent temporal judder that low frame rate 24 and 25fps capture uses more noticeable.  I know there has been some research done into different display tech and the way it changes perception of this stuff.

Thanks noggin, let me try out one of those series tonight to see if it feels any worse than other series which I've been watching on the built in app.

[88keyz]

@88keyz
I just bought the X800H (X80H) and it come with MediaTek 5893 SoC, this is what Aida64 show me... You wrong this device do NOT come with any Realtek RTD2873... the 800H (X80H) come with MediaTek 5893 SoC (I bought the 65" at Costco just now) like displayspecifications say

That's a good thing.  I'm fine with being wrong.

[jambono]

I know its not the place but maybe some know the trick.. I'm looking how to show codecinfo with this xbr sony remote ..

EDIT : OK I used keymap editor add-on its easy and the item is located in fullscreenvideo/Other/PlayerProcessInfo... but I do not have same full infos as CoreElec like Dispaly mode/Pixel Format or EOIF and GAMUT we can show it with "Z" keyboard key but I don't know where is located this key in keymap editor ..

For people like me who want help ..

EDIT OK friends I answer to myself I found a way to add and it work good : In keymap editor kodi addon go to Fullscreen Video->Playback->Change Aspect Ratio edit and put your remote key you will have display too.. same for ProcessInfo and DebugInfo

[wrxtasy]

If  a buyer of an XH9005 cares about picture quality enough to go for a FALD display - surely they are likely to care enough to watch content at original frame rates?  25Hz and 50Hz content at 60Hz is horrible however you process it.

After doing a bunch more reading and questioning owners of modern Sony's in more detail (click), I'm going to backtrack on my earlier statement and apologise to @noggin as well in the process.

Yes you do need an externally HDMI connected media player outputting 50Hz, in territories around the world that - internet - Apps stream 25/50fps. Especially for fast action sports viewing.

Inbuilt Smart TV Apps really cannot cope well with 25/50fps displayed on a 60/120Hz display panel - no matter how much TV Motion Processing you throw at the problem.
2020 Samsung "Q series" TV owners - are also up in arms about similar motion issues faced (click)

[noggin]

If  a buyer of an XH9005 cares about picture quality enough to go for a FALD display - surely they are likely to care enough to watch content at original frame rates?  25Hz and 50Hz content at 60Hz is horrible however you process it.

After doing a bunch more reading and questioning owners of modern Sony's in more detail (click), I'm going to backtrack on my earlier statement and apologise to @noggin as well in the process.

Yes you do need an externally HDMI connected media player outputting 50Hz, in territories around the world that - internet - Apps stream 25/50fps. Especially for fast action sports viewing.

Inbuilt Smart TV Apps really cannot cope well with 25/50fps displayed on a 60/120Hz display panel - no matter how much TV Motion Processing you throw at the problem.
2020 Samsung "Q series" TV owners - are also up in arms about similar motion issues faced (click)

Thanks @wrxtasy - the only apps that Sony TVs (well my XF9005) seem to be able to run at 25/50Hz are HbbTV apps rather than Android TV apps.  I don't know if that is because HbbTV is treated the same as DVB-T/T2/C/S/S2 content (as it's the standard used for IP connected services on DVB platforms, and is used in overlay mode over 50Hz DVB stuff when carrying text content etc., and which has largely replaced MHEG5 in the UK) or if there is a different reason.

[jambono]

OK friends I answer to myself I found a way to add and it work good : In keymap editor kodi addon go to Fullscreen Video->Playback->Change Aspect Ratio edit and put your remote key you will have display too.. same for ProcessInfo and DebugInfo

[eclectice]

The 2019-2020 Sony Line-up uses a variety of SoC + co-processor options.
 

• MediaTek MT5891 (BRAVIA 4K GB/BRAVIA 4K GB ATV3 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A53 @ 1.1 GHz) - Geekbench - X800G
  
• Realtek RTD2873 (BRAVIA VU1 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A55 @ 1.6 GHz) - Geekbench - X750H
  
• MediaTek MT5891 (BRAVIA 4K GB/BRAVIA 4K GB ATV3 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A53 @ 1.1 GHz) + Sony X1 Extreme image co-processor - Geekbench - A8G
  
• MediaTek MT5893 (BRAVIA UR2 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A73 @ 1.5 GHz) + Sony X1 HDR image co-processor - Geekbench - X850G, X800H
  
• MediaTek MT5893 (BRAVIA UR2/BRAVIA UR3 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A73 @ 1.5 GHz) + Sony X1 Ultimate image co-processor - Geekbench - X950G, A9G, X950H, A8H
  
• MediaTek MT5893 (BRAVIA UR2/BRAVIA UR3 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A73 @ 1.5 GHz) + Sony X1 Ultimate image co-processor + Sony 8K image co-processor - Geekbench - Z9G, Z8H
  
• MediaTek MT5895 (BRAVIA VH1 - 4 x ARM Cortex-A73 @ 1.8 GHz) - Geekbench - X900H
  

No 2020 models run the now outdated MT5891 SoC.  It is noticeably slower than the Realtek and MediaTek SoC's that replaced it. 

Sony TV's equipped with the MT5893 SoC all have a separate dedicated X1 series image co-processor to handle the upscaling, motion processing, de-interlacing and HDR processing - a benefit in that the primary SoC doesn't have to handle those additional image processing operations and can focus on other OS related tasks.  The 8K models with the MT5893 also have an additional dedicated 8K image co-processor to handle their single 48Gbps input and the 8K panel upscaling - these 8K TV's do not have full HDMI 2.1 support just a 48Gbps input for 8K/60 and 4K/120 support but no VRR, ALLM, QFT or any other advanced HDMI 2.1 features. 

The MT5895 is the fastest SoC in the lineup but is only found in the X900H at this time and it does not have any additional image co-processors meaning that all upscaling, motion processing, de-interlacing and HDR processing operations must be handled by the primary SoC instead of being handed off to a dedicated processor.  The MT5895 is however the only fully HDMI 2.1 compliant SoC in any Sony TV and, when the firmware is released, will support all of HDMI 2.1's advanced features (with the possible exception of HDR10+ support).

Interesting.

Can the MT5985 SoC on the Sony X90H model support the AV1 codec since it is not reported on the AIDA64 system info app?

I am asking this since Google will make it mandatory to have AV1 hardware support on all TV devices that want to run Android 10 and above...

I have checked the specs for MediaTek MT9612, MT9613, and S900 (MT9950) have the hardware AV1 codec support.

[88keyz]

 

Interesting.

Can the MT5985 SoC on the Sony X90H model support the AV1 codec since it is not reported on the AIDA64 system info app?

I am asking this since Google will make it mandatory to have AV1 hardware support on all TV devices that want to run Android 10 and above...

I have checked the specs for MediaTek MT9612, MT9613, and S900 (MT9950) have the hardware AV1 codec support.

The MT5895 is a custom version of the S900 so yes it will support hardware AV1 decoding. 

The AV1 requirement won't have any impact on existing hardware, only new hardware.  So existing and older devices will still receive Android OS updates regardless of their support for AV1.

[Darockman]

Any feedback using kodi on this sony tv model

https://www.sony.com.sg/electronics/tele...75h-series

I will just use kodi for normal youtube/iptv streaming

Sony X7500H is the model. Any feedback pls?

I run Kodi on the XBR75X900H and it runs great.  I also have a 65" XBRX800H and 2 - 43"XBRX800H sets.  All 3 different models run Kodi 18.9 just fine.