Why XBMC for PS3, Wii, or Xbox360 will probably never happen!

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althekiller Offline
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Information  Why XBMC for PS3, Wii, or Xbox360 will probably never happen!
Post: #1
Question: Can I run XBMC on PS3, Wii, Xbox360, or some random set-top box?
Answer: No, you can't!

Example; just because XBMC runs on Linux and Linux runs on the PS3, by no means implies that XBMC for Linux will just work on the PS3. It doesn't, so deal with it!

Today XBMC for Linux only support x86 CPUs (which the PS3/Wii/Xbox360 doesn't have), and more importantly XBMC Media Center GUI engine REQUIRES real hardware 3D acceleration (which is something that is simply not available under Linux on the PS3/Wii/Xbox360). These are just the most blaring problems, and there are many other hindering things as well, PLEASE JUST SEARCH THESE FORUMS!

If you think we're wrong and believe that XBMC can in fact run on the PS3/Wii/Xbox360 , then you are more than welcome to prove us wrong. XBMC is open source software after all and we would love to see your source code patches for this. However, we don't need updates on library 'X' that supplies 'Y' feature on the PS3/Wii/Xbox360. We don't want to hear your speculation and theories, (that is, unless you are an experienced C/C++ programmer and submit them with source code patches of course Wink).

All and any posts about XBMC on PS3/Wii/Xbox360 from this point forward can and most likely will be deleted or locked unless they're accompanied by source code patches.

All of the above goes ten fold for the Xbox 360 game console. If you want to try to port XBMC to XNA, then please just go ahead and fork the XBMC source code, as there wouldn't likely be much interchangeable code.


UPDATE: Yes we know that XBMC for Linux now also compiles and runs on both PowerPC and ARM processor architecture, but again no, that still does not mean that XBMC for Linux will work on PS3, Wii, Xbox360, or a set-top-box today! It only means the XBMC source code is endian neutral now, and that in its own only means that it is easier for others to port XBMC to other processor architecture, it does not, however, mean that XBMC's GUI engine will be able to fluently render because it does again still REQUIRE real hardware 3D acceleration.
(This post was last modified: 2012-06-17 00:21 by Ned Scott.)
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waldo22 Offline
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Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA
Post: #2
OK, never say never. But...

XBMC can not work on the Popcorn Hour, NMT (Networked Media Tank), Tvix, Mvix, Myka, Netgear Digital Entertainer, Ruku, Dlink DSM, Sage TV HD Extender, or any set-top-box that uses a Sigma Designs' chipset for the following reasons:
  • Sigma 862x (older boxes) use an ARM Processor (porting to ARM processor architecture is being worked on though)
  • Sigma 863x (newer boxes such as the PopcornHour) use MIPS processor architecture.
  • No GPU (and thus no 3D hardware acceleration)
  • No OpenGL support
  • Sigma won't release sources needed to access the video acceleration hardware, even though these sources are statically linked in the kernel of the microLinux distro they use.
  • ffmpeg doesn't support Sigma's acceleration, even if we did have access to the hardware and sources
This above is only the short list, all of which are on their own a 'showstopper' reason why XBMC will not run on these devices.

Here's a longer list, which I will just use Netgear's Digital Entertainer HD (EVA-8000) as an example:

EVA-8000 hardware:
Code:
Sigma Chip: Sigma [url=http://www.sigmadesigns.com/public/Products/selection_guide/selection_guide.html]EM8623L [/url](non-MacroVision version of EM8622)

HDMI Chip: Silicon Image VastLane SiI9030CTU
[url]http://www.siliconimage.com/iplicensing/hdmi.aspx?catid=14[/url]
[url]http://www.siliconimage.com/products/reference.aspx?id=2[/url]

Flash chip: Macronix MX [url=http://www.macronix.com/QuickPlace/hq/PageLibrary48256F55002C90A5.nsf/h_Toc/75d338438656550a48256f5500408bf7/?OpenDocument]29LV640BTTC-90G[/url] (MX29 series flash)
Should be the 3rd one down in the 64Mb section (8 MB flash) section

Ethernet: Realtek [url=http://www.realtek.com.tw/products/productsView.aspx?Langid=1&PNid=14&PFid=6&Level=5&Conn=4&ProdID=14]RTL8100CL[/url] chipset

USB: Via [url=http://www.via.com.tw/en/products/peripherals/usb/vt6212/]VT6212L[/url]

Wireless: no idea. some generic chipset on an mPCI card, hidden beneath an EMI shield

If you'll read the specs on the Sigma Website, you'll note that this box uses a 200Mhz ARM processor. With that slow of a chip, everything will have to be done in hardware.

The newer boxes such as PCH use a 300Mhz MIPS processor.

The only type of acceleration that appears to be offered by Sigma is a very vague "2D Graphics Acceleration" which is done by their proprietary drivers.

With no GPU and no OpenGL support, we would have to rely on Sigma's hardware to do the acceleration for us in a proprietary way, but it's unclear if their hardware even supports 3D acceleration at all, much less in a way compatible with OpenGL.

In addition, ffmpeg would have to support video decoding through the Sigma drivers in the same way that the VDPAU branch uses ffmpeg support for VDPAU in the Nvidia drivers.

All of this is moot, since Simga won't release the tarballs for their drivers' source.

Netgear has released the sources for their Digital Entertainer HD, but they include the following steps in their readme:
Quote:2. Install Toolchain

Obtain Sigma Designs ARM Toolchain v
2.5.103.0(armutils_22.5.103.0.tgz). Install
the toolchain as instructed in the package.

3. Building Kernel

Obtain Sigma 8622 MRUA v2.8.0.2 distribution
(mrua_EM8622L_2.8.0.2_dev.arm.nodts.tgz)
Untar mrua_EM8622L_2.8.0.2_dev.arm.nodts.tgz and build Sigma 8622 video
drivers
Copy Sigma video drivers (llad.o and em8xxx.o) to kernel folder
arch/armnomu/mach-em86xx
Execute ./makelinks located in root of linux-2.4.22-em86xx
Execute make

How exactly does one "obtain" the Sigma Toolchain and MRUA to build the drivers?

Here's a thread on the subject http://forum1.netgear.com/showthread.php?t=20991 (registration required, sorry)

Clearly, Sigma isn't interested in releasing their sources.

So, for XBMC to happen on a Sigma-based platform, the following would have to happen:

  1. Port XBMC to compile on ARM and/or MIPS
  2. Sigma has to release their tarballs
  3. These drivers have to support some type of 3D acceleration
  4. If this 3D acceleration is not OpenGL compatable, or doesn't have an OGL wrapper, XBMC would have to change it's code to support this new acceleration
  5. If all this happened, the ffmpeg project would have to support the video acceleration in the same way that they support VDPAU (as there's no way ANY video can run on a 200Mhz ARM processor, not even SD)


In short, it's not bloody likely.

Sad

Hope this helps stop some of the porting requests,

-Wes
(This post was last modified: 2009-07-17 14:32 by Gamester17.)
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Jyujinkai Offline
Senior Member
Posts: 191
Joined: Jul 2008
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Question  Are there any HD Media Players that XBMC for Linux can run on?
Post: #3
Hi there....

Dose anyone know if there are any HD media players that support XBMC or XBMC can drive oir somthing?

I have been looking at
WD HDTV Media Player
or the
ICY BOX

Both support all format types like mkv, h264 etc etc.. and can stream to HD full 1080p surround sound and all that with no frame drops and all but none of them have any cool media library solutions..

I love XBMC and have been using it 4 years from when it was XBMP.....

Is there a way to use xbmc with some kind of device like this?

Thanks in advance
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watzen Offline
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Location: Sweden
Post: #4
Nope, xbmc requires a x86 compatible computer with opengl compatible graphics card.

  • Livingroom - C2D E8400, P5N7A-VM on a Samsung 46" LE46M86 FullHD via HDMI
  • Kitchen - ASRock 330 HT Displayed on a Samsung Lapfit 22" dual touch screen LD220Z
  • Bedroom - LG Laptop on a 32" tv
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Gamester17 Offline
Team-XBMC Forum Moderator
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Location: Sweden
Post: #5
http://forum.xbmc.org/tags.php?tag=arm

...it is not like this question has not been asked before Rolleyes ...and XBMC for Mac has already been ported to PPC (PowerPC) Big Grin

...and know that McGeagh is currently in the progress of porting XBMC for ARM which is one step closer to make this happen someday Wink
http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=35139

However almost none of them support hardware accelerated 3D graphics No also many of these boxes use MIPS instead of ARM Sad

Still, believe it or not but XBMC GUI engine requires hardware 3D acceleration for it to render XBMC GUI at an acceptable framerate!

Nod

Always read the XBMC online-manual, FAQ and search the forum before posting.
Do not e-mail XBMC-Team members directly asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting please make sure you read this first.
(This post was last modified: 2009-07-29 11:02 by Gamester17.)
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Martijn Offline
Team Kodi
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Location: Dawn of time
Post: #6
To update DO NOT ask for XBOX One

Always read the XBMC online-manual, FAQ and search the forums before posting.
Do NOT e-mail Team-XBMC members asking for support. Read/follow the forum rules.
For troubleshooting and bug reporting, make sure you read this first

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