Commercial HTPCs running XBMC?
#1
I recently built an HTPC to complete my home theater setup. I am running openSUSE 11.1 and XBMC compiled from the latest (as of two weeks ago) SVN. Being a Unix sysadmin, I couldn't sleep well until I got everything working "perfectly". No more random "pops" and "clicks" in audio output, no more vsync and tearing issues, great upconvert quality, automatic screen resolution detection, 1080p playback smooth as a baby's bottom, reliable playback of all sorts of popular and weird formats. And, of course, a 10Tb RAID 10 array with hot-swappable disks. In other words, if I bought this system at a store for several thousand dollars (and I actually briefly considered just buying an HTPC from one of the well-known, overpriced brands), I would have been very satisfied with features, performance, and reliability.

This got me thinking. I may know quite a bit about Unix, which helped be give my HTPC a certain polish, but I am definitely not the brightest light in the harbor when it comes to building HTPCs. My expertise lies primarily in the direction of HPC clusters and high-performance storage. So why aren't there any commercial HTPCs out there using XBMC or Boxee? I looked online and browsed through issues of Electronic House, lined with glossy photos of uber-expensive home theater monster machines and found nothing. Sure, there are some media servers and home automation devices running Linux, but the vast majority of players run WMC or some software developed by the HTPC makers themselves.

So what if the problem is not technical, I thought, but legal. I understand XBMC code compiled for Xbox uses MS XDK and so that would put the breaks on any attempt to re-sell modded xboxes with pre-compiled XBMC code. But Linux XBMC compilations don't use XDK - am I wrong? Yet, there may be pieces here and there - not in the source code but, perhaps in some libraries or codecs - that step on some copyright toes. I am no legal expert, but according to Wikipedia, libdvdcss that allows CSS-encrypted DVD playback may be a source of concern. Then there is an issue of various codecs that may use some patented compression algorithms or may load some third-party unlicensed DLLs. Once again, I understand the SVN is all good and clean, but I can't very well play a DVD or an MP3 with just the source code.

Can someone knowledgeable shed some light on the situation? Why no commercial XBMC/Linux-based HTPCs? Did I just miss them in my search and, if not, how much is this a technical challenge of being better than the competition vs. various legal obstacles? It would be great to see this excellent software being available to consumers - those less fortunate folk without computer science degrees or an oscilloscope and five different soldering irons in their computer tool collection (but with money) - while providing the much-needed financial incentive to the developers' community.

Thanks,
Ven
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#2
hey,

the reason is simple and has been said many times..

because its GPL and some parts of XBMC codebase are borrowed (for example UPNP)

the license of UPNP states that it isn't allowed to be 'sold'..

so in that aspect
you could build a perfectly working HTPC that would work with XBMC 100% etc

but you wouldn't be allowed to mass produce it with XBMC installed..

however if you have the machine etc.. and you offer an ISO on your website.. with the idea of 'insert next next installed'
then it 'would' be ok...

the problem is that the vast majority even this is to hard..
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#3
Not sure why you think XBMC is a "problem," legal or whatever, being bundled with HTPCs. Boxee is certainly vying to be a commercial outfit, and its media code base is from XBMC. The problem, if you want to label it that, is about content, and the legality of XBMC.

First, the content. People buy a HTPC to enjoy multimedia (AV) content. Without content, it's like a computer without software, i.e. useless. Accessing online content, e.g. Hulu, Youtube, etc will be problematic, as you (the HTPC vendor) have to negotiate deals with the content owner, in order for your software to link to their content. "Problematic" here means that it will cost money, which in turn means that you have to make money from the users, either by getting them to watch ads or by getting them to pay. XBMC is suited for none of these things by itself.

To access offline content, e.g. DVDs, means you have to provide a means for users to get those material into the box, which for now is still illegal (using rippers) and require some degree of tech proficiency. I don't know of any commercial venture who is angling for the offline market. Whatever is out there is relegated to mainly online (streaming) content.

Second, watchable online video, and thus content, has just recently become viable. Youtube has just started with HD, and Hulu, et al are still in the pilot stage of deployment. Netflix's Watch Now is just getting a larger library. So, the content volume is starting to pick up, and then you'll see market solutions to link to it.

Rest assured, however, that every outfit will want compensation for their effort. The stuff that XBMC is doing (or is trying to do)--deep-linking to content w/o the owners' consent--is really a form of piracy. And while it's OK as long as it stays under the radar (read: limited to the techie crowd), no commercial solution can be based upon it until you negotiate with the content owners. Just as P2P will always be around in some form, so there will always be tech solutions to freebie content, but don't confuse their existence with their legality.
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#4
Not sure why you think XBMC is a "problem," legal or whatever, being bundled with HTPCs. Boxee is certainly vying to be a commercial outfit, and its media code base is from XBMC. The problem, if you want to label it that, is about content, and the legality of XBMC.

First, the content. People buy a HTPC to enjoy multimedia (AV) content. Without content, it's like a computer without software, i.e. useless. Accessing online content, e.g. Hulu, Youtube, etc will be problematic, as you (the HTPC vendor) have to negotiate deals with the content owner, in order for your software to link to their content. Accessing offline content, e.g. DVDs, means you have to provide a means for users to get those material into the box, which for now is still illegal (using rippers) and require some degree of tech proficiency. I don't know of any commercial venture who is angling for the offline market. Whatever is out there is relegated to mainly online (streaming) content.

Second, watchable online video, and thus content, has just recently become viable. Youtube has just started with HD, and Hulu, et al are still in the pilot stage of deployment. Netflix's Watch Now is just getting a larger library. So, the content volume is starting to pick up, and then you'll see market solutions to link to it.

Rest assured, however, that every outfit will want compensation for their effort. The stuff that XBMC is doing (or is trying to do)--deep-linking to content w/o the owners' consent--is really a form of piracy. And while it's OK as long as it stays under the radar (read: limited to the techie crowd), no commercial solution can be based upon it until you negotiate with the content owners. Just as P2P will always be around in some form, so there will always be tech solutions to freebie content, but don't confuse their existence with their legality.

Note: I'm assuming by XBMC you mean the generic FLOSS multimedia settop solution, as there are other efforts.
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#5
Editing looks to be broke. It doesn't remove the original post.

MODEDIT: Works fine for me :p
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Commercial HTPCs running XBMC?0