[icedtrip]

So far, I see a common factor being VC1 and E-AC-3, perhaps time to try some h264 ?

@davilla

As Observer mentioned, these are direct rips from Blurays or HD-DVDs. Re-encoding into h264 is far from ideal and very time consuming, plus we know that the CrystalHD can handle full quality VC1 videos with no problems, its only those in MKV containers that are problematic.

I also made a few clips having ripped out all E-AC-3 audio and then some with ALL audio ripped out. I still have the exact same issues, so it doesn't appear to be a VC1 / E-AC-3 combo issue.

Again, if I use an m2ts container, the file plays back just fine with all audio intact. This too is less than ideal, because the method I have been using causes me to lose my subtitle and chapter tracks.

[shaunb]

Am I right in thinking the latest Nightly Builds don't have Crystal HD Support ?
I blindly updated assuming it would still be supported, having not seen anything to the contrary.

[davilla]

should be supported. I'll check.

[illiac4]

Video does work normally if crystal hd is disabled. If enabled it shows but it is slow, full of artifacts and jerky, so it is not watchable.
UPS this is card 70012 just for info.

http://pastebin.com/2XH0UFFY

P.S.:
The same video is also not working on ATV2 in neither way (not if hardware acceleration is enabled and also not if disabled).

[defiler]

I'm seeing a few people having trouble with VC1 BluRay rips, and I'm one of them

I'm running an AppleTV, with Sam's new Crystalbuntu image. My CrystalHD card is probably a year old now, so this will be the 70012. H264 works a treat - no issues at all. VC1 flickers between the menu screen and black - not updating at all. The sound plays fine.

Before I get into logfiles and such, let's start with the basics:
Will CrystalHD decode VC1 video correctly?
Will CrystalHD in an AppleTV running Linux decode VC1 correctly?
Will the 70012 cards do this, or does it need to be a later card?

Edit: Something of a corollary to the above, does XBMC 10.1 support VC1?

Recoding to H264 is not always an option - I can't get subtitles to work properly with the tools I have, so forced subs are gone. So should this work?

[Observer]

I'm now also running Sam's new Crystalbuntu image too (V.Cool), and still have the same issues with VC-1 inside MKV, with the same symptoms as before.

I also still have some re-createable picture freezes for h264 in MKV, just need to work out how to create a test clip as its a ways into the movie (Avatar - Directors Cut).

@davilla - What do we need to do to help get the VC-1 issue resolved ? Please can you help us, to help you (or who is responsible for the bit of code that is causing the problems), to help us :-)

Thanks !

[defiler]

Well, it's a little frustrating that nobody managed to give me an answer on this one, but at the same time I acept that the devs have better things to do, which I'm sure I'll be more grateful for in the long term. Anyway, here are the answers to my own questions, in the hope that they'll clear things up for others:

Will CrystalHD decode VC1 video correctly?

Yes, but it depends on the particular encoding. The BCM70012 specs are here, and the 70015 seems to be basically the same in terms of codec support. The videos I'm having trouble with all have mediainfo containing the following:

Code:

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : VC-1
Format profile                   : AP@L3
Codec ID                         : WVC1
Codec ID/Hint                    : Microsoft

If you check the Broadcom spec, the card supports AP@L3 for SMPTE encoding only, not for WMV9 (the Microsoft codec). Unfortunately that's *all* of my VC-1 movies, but there's nothing I can find to suggest that other VC-1 encoding formats won't work. Just check them off the Broadcom codec list.

Will CrystalHD in an AppleTV running Linux decode VC1 correctly?

Yep, subject to the above. If the CrystalHD doesn't handle the particular encoding, you're out of luck.

Will the 70012 cards do this, or does it need to be a later card?

70015 cards seem to be in the same boat. The Broadcom site's not very clear on this, but Logic Supply list the codecs here.

Something of a corollary to the above, does XBMC 10.1 support VC1?

Yep - absolutely. But if you're reliant on the CrystalHD you have to play within the limits of the decoder chip. The ION boards seem to handle these movies fine, and if you have enough CPU grunt you're sorted. The AppleTV has neither. Better warm up HandBrake.

So there you have it. There are some things that the CrystalHD just doesn't do. That leaves you with three choices:

1. Live with it.
   
2. Go buy a different XBMC (and possibly change your telly if you're relying on Component Video like me).
   
3. Go and design yourself a video decoder chip that does all the codecs you want.
   

I hope that's cleared up some confusion. I'm certainly glad to have a resolution, even if it's not the one I'd hoped for.

[icedtrip]

Yes, but it depends on the particular encoding. The BCM70012 specs are here, and the 70015 seems to be basically the same in terms of codec support. The videos I'm having trouble with all have mediainfo containing the following:

Code:

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : VC-1
Format profile                   : AP@L3
Codec ID                         : WVC1
Codec ID/Hint                    : Microsoft

If you check the Broadcom spec, the card supports AP@L3 for SMPTE encoding only, not for WMV9 (the Microsoft codec). Unfortunately that's *all* of my VC-1 movies, but there's nothing I can find to suggest that other VC-1 encoding formats won't work. Just check them off the Broadcom codec list.

I'm not so sure this is the case. I have been trying to get help with this issue for awhile. I have brought it up several times in this thread, in other threads, and in its own (see http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=96291 ).

My reason for thinking CrystalHD should be able to handle these videos is because it has no problem when they are in an m2ts container. I have used TSMuxer to place the video and audio tracks from an MKV container to an m2ts container. No re-encoding occurs. With that said, the Media Info on the m2ts resulting file doesn't reference any codec (let alone a WVC1 codec) as the MKV file does, but I'm not sure why. Regardless, the m2ts file plays flawlessly with CrystalHD.

Davilla made the observation a few pages back "So far, I see a common factor being VC1 and E-AC-3, perhaps time to try some h264 ? " but I ran a few more tests removing all audio from the MKV containers and still had the same issues. There hasn't been any follow up since and the h264 suggestion is far from ideal since it would require me to have to re-encode half of my library which would also degrade quality from the direct rips.

I'm not sure if Davilla has plans to come back to the CrystalHD drivers or not since there has been no source code changes since Oct 26, 2010, but I hope he can help resolve this issue.

Again, I see what you are saying based off the specs, but my tests seem to show otherwise when the video file is in a different container (in my case, an m2ts). I would just use TSMuxer on all my problem videos, but as stated before, an m2ts container will not support PGS subtitle tracks, and many of my movies would be terrible without them due to forced subtitles.

[Observer]

So from an OSX perspective what is the most efficient tool/way to remux VC-1 (AP@L3) file with DTS sound tracks with minimal conversion to maintain as much of the original rip as possible and perhaps even keep chapters (not use m2ts) ?

Is it possible to convert from WMV9 to SMPTE encoding inside a MKV container ?

Any thoughts ?

[Observer]

Additionally would you expect this to play on a BCM70015. Given the documented specification on the BCM70012 was

Code:

MPEG-2 MP @ ML and MP @ HL

I cant find specific specs but assuming some backward compatibility to the BCM70012, BCM70015 supposedly supports MP@HL, that seems to correspond to Main@high (from my Media Info below) ?

here.

It play very slowly.

Here is the log

Code:

* * * Media Inspector 0.7.430 file analysis report.
* * * Media Inspector is ©2011 by Diego Massanti - http://mediainfo.massanti.com
* * * MediaInfoLib by Jerome Martinez - http://mediainfo.sourceforge.net
Created on: May 31, 2011 1:34:16 PM PDT
Report for file: Fringe - Lysergic Acid Diethylamide.mpg

General / Container Stream #1
    Total Video Streams for this File.................1
    Total Audio Streams for this File.................1
    Total Subtitle Streams for this File..............1
    Video Codecs Used.................................[color=red]MPEG-2[/color] Video
    Audio Codecs Used.................................AC3
    File Format.......................................MPEG-PS
    Play Time.........................................1h 15mn
    Total File Size...................................6.97 GiB
    Total Stream BitRate..............................13.3 Mbps
Video Stream #1
    Codec (Human Name)................................MPEG Video
    Codec Profile.....................................[color=red]Main@High[/color]
    Frame Width.......................................1280 pixels
    Frame Height......................................720 pixels
    Frame Rate........................................59.940 fps
    Total Frames......................................269778
    Display Aspect Ratio..............................16:9
    Scan Type.........................................Progressive
    Color Space.......................................YUV
    QF (like Gordian Knot)............................0.228
    Codec Settings (Matrix)...........................Default
    Video Stream Length...............................1h 15mn 0s 796ms
    Video Stream BitRate..............................12.6 Mbps
    Video Stream BitRate (Nominal)....................20.0 Mbps
    Video Stream BitRate Mode.........................VBR
    Bit Depth.........................................8 bits
    Video Stream Size.................................6.60 GiB (95%)
Audio Stream #1
    Codec.............................................AC-3
    Audio Stream Length...............................1h 15mn 0s 704ms
    Audio Stream BitRate..............................448 Kbps
    Audio Stream BitRate Mode.........................CBR
    Number of Audio Channels..........................6
    Audio Channel's Positions.........................Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
    Sampling Rate.....................................48.0 KHz
    Bit Depth.........................................16 bits
    Audio Stream Delay................................567ms
    Audio Stream Size.................................240 MiB (3%)
Subtitle Stream #1
    Format............................................EIA-608

Here is a screen shot:

[naa3e5]

Just as a quick bump... I am having these issues as well... currently using Sams image for ATV and CrystalHD ... VC1 = massive stutters completely unplayable... H264 works fine...

[Observer]

Just as a quick bump... I am having these issues as well... currently using Sams image for ATV and CrystalHD ... VC1 = massive stutters completely unplayable... H264 works fine...

@naa3e5 VC1? Which encoding SMPTE or WMV9, and you should be able to gather this from the media info, based off the Codec ID/Hint where WMV9 == Microsoft.

If its the former, then it seems from all the commentary around here (mostly from @icedtrip and @defiler) that in the long run it's fixable, along side support for other codecs like MPEG2, but its going to take some dedication from someone that know what they are doing with the drivers as it seems now h.264 works well, the assumption is that everyone will re-encode to that codec, and accept any quality loss in the process...

There seems no motivation out there to do this. One hopes that with enough folks asking it might move up the priority list.

If its the latter, its not supported by the Crystal HD card, so re-encoding is the only option.

I know that Sam is working on his distribution to do some GPU clocking...that may improve software decoding, so this "may" help in some cases (like for MPEG2).

As above, if I knew of a way to efficiently re-encode VC-1 WMV9 to SMPTE I'd do that...otherwise I believe it's gonna be a long wait.

[icedtrip]

So, this past weekend, I decided to run a test that I haven't seen performed yet. I installed Windows 7 on my Mac Mini, updated everything, and installed the Broadcom drivers directly downloaded from their site.

The end result was the same as OS X. All the MKV files I threw at it with VC1 video would play audio but no video. I had hoped the problem was with the OS X drivers and could be fixed, but apparently that does not appear to be the case.

The one thing I forgot to test was using one of the other video programs that support the Crystal HD in Windows to see if they show the same issues. So I will have to do that sometime over the next couple of days and will report back.

[homer_doh]

Frame Width.......................................1280 pixels
Frame Height......................................720 pixels
Frame Rate........................................59.940 fps

I've been trying to track down slow/out of sync playback and so far all problematic files have been 59.94 fps. I have a Mac mini with BCM70012 and an Apple TV 2, both have problems with 59.94 fps video and out of sync audio.

With Crystal HD hardware decoding enabled, the Mac mini plays the video at 59.9 fps for a few seconds, then sharply drop to a stuttering ~12 fps and the audio is seconds off.

If I disable Crystal HD hardware decoding, the Mac mini plays the video at 59.9 fps with audio in sync.

The Apple TV 2 plays the video at ~22 fps (slow motion), with audio seconds off.

Tried disabling hardware decoding on the Apple TV 2 too but it isn't powerful enough to deal with 720p wihtout it.

I'm currently using xbmc-20110627-fb6c6f9-master-i386.dmg with dirty region enabled, but have had the same problems with XBMC 10.1.

Mac OS X 10.6.8, Mac mini C2D 1.86 GHz, 2 GB RAM, BCM70012 with driver/kext r172 (latest version with power handling enabled).

xbmc.log: http://pastebin.com/fG51Fg2f
Mediainfo: http://pastebin.com/Puxru9eR

[homer_doh]

davilla, is there a roadmap for Crystal HD in Mac mini/ATV? There hasn't been any updates to the driver/kext since october 2010. It works quite well for me, 720p @ 59.94 is pretty much the only (repeatable) issue I have.

The ATV2 has to be a tough competitor (I have one, for the money it's incredible) and I understand if the development focus has shifted to that platform. I'm not complaining or anything, just want to know if Crystal HD in Mac mini is still in active development?